Home › Forums › Shidduchim › Best Proposal Stories
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January 11, 2011 5:08 pm at 5:08 pm #594113miamigirl613Member
What are the best proposal stories that you’ve heard and how would you ultimately propose if you have’t yet?
January 11, 2011 5:20 pm at 5:20 pm #728211boredstiffParticipantYou started a post about stories, but you didnt even post one?!
Well, recently there was a proposal on youtube- it was insane!( Wondering if anyone here knows which one I’m talking abt.)
January 11, 2011 5:47 pm at 5:47 pm #728213popa_bar_abbaParticipantI think an elaborate proposal is a cop out from having to actually express your feelings.
January 11, 2011 6:03 pm at 6:03 pm #728214WolfishMusingsParticipantWhile I’m a *big* believer in romantic guestures and all that, for Eees and I, it was very simple.
We were celebrating the anniversary of the day that we met (a day we still celebrate in addition to our wedding anniversary date). I brought over a bottle of champagne and we were going to have a small low-key celebration. Instead, I brought over the champagne and a ring*. We sat on the couch, I told her that I was so happy that she had come into my life, and that I couldn’t imagine life without her and that I was hoping she’d choose to spend the rest of it with me.
That was it.
The Wolf
* Actually, I didn’t have an engagement ring ready then — but I didn’t want to let the occasion pass. So, I bought a candy ring. Eeees is probably the only person I know who ate her engagement ring. 🙂 Yes, we got a real engagement ring later on.
January 11, 2011 6:08 pm at 6:08 pm #728215Sender AvMemberBoredStiff, are you talking about a frum proposal or a goyisha one?
I remember seeing one (a frum one) where the girl loved shopping at target and her chosson got them to play some chevra song on all the tvs in the electronics section and had her friend bring her to target.When she got to the electronics section he rolled(a cart) over to her with flowers and a ring. I dont think she even noticed the video. It was real cheesy. I apologize if the guy who did this is reading this(it was still “smart and original”. On a similar note I remember one of my sister’s friends saying she thought it was so romantic to be proposed to in a walmart(as that is where she would most likely go on her first date).
January 11, 2011 6:11 pm at 6:11 pm #728216crdleMemberboredstiff- r u talking about that frum guy who made a whole video with a guitar for the girl?
January 11, 2011 6:11 pm at 6:11 pm #728217Sender AvMemberWolf, that is actually my plan(the ring part). I hope they still make those chocolate rings from Israel when I meet someone and am ready to get married…and I will probably eat the ring myself before she gets to it.
January 11, 2011 6:38 pm at 6:38 pm #728218yaff80ParticipantIsnt giving a ring direct, a problem of kesef kidushin?
January 11, 2011 6:44 pm at 6:44 pm #728219popa_bar_abbaParticipantI always wondered that.
A guy says, “will you marry me”
she says, “yes”
He gives her a ring.
If there were eidim, how are they not married?
January 11, 2011 7:02 pm at 7:02 pm #728220dunnoMemberDon’t you also have to say “harei at mekudeshes…” for it to be considered kiddushin?
January 11, 2011 7:13 pm at 7:13 pm #728221Mevakesh1Memberpopa_bar_abba – In response to your question, yes the boy is not allowed to hand her the ring. When I got engaged (B”H I’m married now with a few kids KA”H) my Chosson put the ring down – didn’t actually hand it to me. He also reminded me that it’s not Kiddushin. (He actually had it waiting for me in the car when he came to pick me up…)
January 11, 2011 7:14 pm at 7:14 pm #728222popa_bar_abbaParticipantNot really.
The gemara says if they were “asukin b’oso inyan” and he gave it to her, there is kiddushin.
January 11, 2011 7:24 pm at 7:24 pm #728223WolfishMusingsParticipantIsnt giving a ring direct, a problem of kesef kidushin?
In my case, the matter is now academic.
In any event, can it be said that it is kesef kiddushin when both parties know and understand that it’s not and that there will be an actual kiddushin later on?
In other words, if both parties agree that the ring is NOT for kiddushin, then how could you possibly say that it is?
The Wolf
January 11, 2011 7:29 pm at 7:29 pm #728224popa_bar_abbaParticipantWolf:
The issue would be that if they manifested an intention of kiddushin, we would probably say that the actual intention is irrelevant since “devarim shebileiv einum devarim”.
Now, I suppose you might argue that here everyone knows that this manifestation of kiddushin is not real- and that makes it not a manifestation. Maybe it is like if they are actors in a play. I wonder what the halacha in such a case.
January 11, 2011 7:32 pm at 7:32 pm #728225dunnoMemberI second Wolf’s question.
January 11, 2011 7:33 pm at 7:33 pm #728226frumladygitMemberAcutally I don’t know how I ended up marrying my husband as he officially never did ask me to. LOL
I guess being in shidduchim we both knew we weren’t interviewing one another for prospective housecleaning positions! But rather for husband and wife purposes.
Maybe I should mention that to him tonight? He still has yet to propose? Is proposing like the non jews do it the norm in the frum world? : Guy gets down on one knee and says: “Jenny will you be my wife”?
January 11, 2011 7:39 pm at 7:39 pm #728227gavra_at_workParticipantAidim.
If the proposal is done in private, or even with only family there, there are no aidim and there are no questions; it CAN NOT be for Kiddushin.
Alt: If the ring has a stone, we Paskin it can not be used for Kiddushin as is (see Keddushin 7b-8a).
January 11, 2011 7:41 pm at 7:41 pm #728228gavra_at_workParticipantPBA: In your example, they are married (assuming the ring did not have a stone). L’Chorah, they would not be belived that they did not want to get married at the time (due to D’varim Sheb’lev).
Another simple way out is to ask a relative to be an Aid, thereby Passuling the Keddushin. Ask your LOR for actual details.
January 11, 2011 7:51 pm at 7:51 pm #728229aries2756ParticipantIt is pretty customary these days that the boy gives the girl a bracelet when he proposes. It is a token gift. The ring is usually given beofore the “vort”.
January 11, 2011 7:56 pm at 7:56 pm #728230PosterMembereclipse, I actually think a Dvar Torah is a very nice way of proposing. My husband didnt propose since it is not done in our circles. (We go through a shadchan)
January 11, 2011 8:12 pm at 8:12 pm #728231smartcookieMemberA diamond ring isn’t really for Kedushin. A Kedushin ring has to be a lot cheaper.
January 11, 2011 8:55 pm at 8:55 pm #728233Brooklyn YentaParticipantboredstiff: the one with the maccabeats?
January 11, 2011 9:03 pm at 9:03 pm #728234eclipseMemberPoster–It took me awhile to get what he meant.
January 11, 2011 11:58 pm at 11:58 pm #728235Smile E. FaceMemberboredstiff-the chava mindel maccabeats one?
January 12, 2011 12:10 am at 12:10 am #728236cshapiroMemberits actually chavi and yossi…i know them, and i think it was very cute…smile E. btw, her name is chava raizel
January 12, 2011 12:13 am at 12:13 am #728237Smile E. FaceMembermy bad:) my friend told me about it and i watched it at her house, but i can’t say that i was really paying attn…
January 12, 2011 1:56 am at 1:56 am #728238bein_hasdorimParticipantThe guy took her sky diving… They get to the open door, the guy as he’s jumping out shouts “I can’t think of anyone i’d rather take the plunge with.”
The girl looks out and says to herself “I can’t think of anyone I would take this plunge with!” They didn’t end up together.
January 12, 2011 4:08 am at 4:08 am #728240eclipseMembermods…thanks:)
January 12, 2011 4:38 am at 4:38 am #728241GabboimMemberThe maccabeats proposal had eidim, so why wasn’t the marriage consummated then and there?
bein_hasdorim, is that story a joke?
January 12, 2011 5:16 am at 5:16 am #728242oomisParticipantI would think that giving an engagement ring is not the same, because there is no kavanah that this is a kiddushin, only an engagement.
January 12, 2011 2:14 pm at 2:14 pm #728243SJSinNYCMemberI don’t know if this is an urban legend or not. When I was around 10 years old I hear it.
There was a school play and they had a “marriage” scene. Two kids, over bar/bat mitzvah went up, said Harei at with others around and he handed her a ring. It was part of the plot. What I heard was it was paskened as a real wedding and they had to get an actual divorce of sorts…but there was no yichud afterwards so I don’t know how it actually went down.
January 12, 2011 2:24 pm at 2:24 pm #728244whatelseisleftMemberyeah.
whats the deal with that?
i’ve heard it a bunch of times before– and then the girl can’t marry a kohen or anything?
does anyone have any backing of that?
January 13, 2011 4:06 am at 4:06 am #728246YatzmichMemberI don’t know why people don’t take the “Chashash Kidushin” more seriously. Would you play with a light switch on Shabbos? Of course not. Kiddushin is 1,000,000 times more serious. If you are proposing, stay away from the ring or anything that remotely looks like you are making a real kidushin. Please, don’t mess up, the ramifications could be for generations.
About that story, yes it’s true, it happened MANY years ago, and I think it was Rav Moshe Z”TL who paskened that the boy has to give her a get to remove all Chashoshos.
Boys, if your man enough to get married, then “man up,” and ask the question, “Will you marry me?” You can get videos and get the waiters to do all types of things and spend lots of money, but you’re not a man unless you ask it yourself.
January 13, 2011 4:16 am at 4:16 am #728247WolfishMusingsParticipantI don’t know why people don’t take the “Chashash Kidushin” more seriously. Would you play with a light switch on Shabbos? Of course not. Kiddushin is 1,000,000 times more serious. If you are proposing, stay away from the ring or anything that remotely looks like you are making a real kidushin. Please, don’t mess up, the ramifications could be for generations.
Please address my question above. If both parties know and understand that the ring is not for kiddushin, why would you think there is a possibility that it’s a valid kiddushin.
I gave my niece a birthday present last year. Do you think I’m married to her because I didn’t explicitly say “this isn’t for kiddushin?” After all, we both knew that it wasn’t for kiddushin, even though we didn’t say it.
The Wolf
January 13, 2011 4:22 am at 4:22 am #728248popa_bar_abbaParticipantWolf:
It seems more complicated than that.
Firstly, devarim she’b’leiv einum devarim, so if you manifest kiddushin it is irrelevant what you actually thought.
Secondly, if the couple was “assukin b’oso inyan” (of marriage), the gemara says we assume the money was given for kiddushin and accepted for kiddushin.
So, you were presumably not talking about marrying your niece. If you were, it would present a similar difficulty.
I think the main question here probably is whether we can say it was not kiddushin when everyone knows it is not kiddushin despite that the classic manifestation is present.
January 13, 2011 5:30 am at 5:30 am #728249GabboimMemberLet’s say the proposal was a kiddushin. Then they have a chuppa 3 months later. What is the problem with the proposal/kiddushin?
January 13, 2011 11:50 am at 11:50 am #728250Bob SquappstienParticipantGabboim: If he gave her the ring in a way that would be kiddushin, and they subsequently broke off their engagement, he would need to give her a get. She would never be able to marry a Kohen after that. Pretty serious if you ask me. But that doesn’t mean that anyone who proposed in front of a crowd would suddenly be married.
BTW, my proposal was insanely awesome, it took abt 15 minutes, on the bank of a quiet lake at sunset. It was in middle of a lightening storm, and right when I popped the question, a big bolt of lightening streaked from the sky till the lake. It started pouring abt 30 seconds later.
January 13, 2011 12:33 pm at 12:33 pm #728251yankdownunderMemberBob amazing story what an Earth Shatter Moment.
January 13, 2011 2:02 pm at 2:02 pm #728252PosterMemberI know of a guy that took his date to a car wash. And at the end, the car wash guy held up a towel that said, “Will you marry me.”
Maybe bec it is not done in my circles, it seems childish to me. Marriage is a serious thing, not a contest of who can come up with the most creative way of breaking it out! IMO, save your creativity for your first anniversary, at that time, make the wackiest, most romantic, funfilled shtick, that you can treaure as a married couple.
January 13, 2011 8:59 pm at 8:59 pm #728253oomisParticipantIf there were eidim, how are they not married”
What – no kesubah???
January 13, 2011 9:03 pm at 9:03 pm #728254WolfishMusingsParticipantWhat – no kesubah???
The lack of a kesubah does not invalidate the marriage, nor does it prevent one from taking place. If your kesubah gets lost, you are required to get a new one, but in the interim you are still 100% married.
Furthermore, a kesubah is only required from the nesuin onward. It is not required for kiddushin at all.
The Wolf
January 13, 2011 9:04 pm at 9:04 pm #728255s2021MemberGuy asks girl to marry him
Girl doesnt know what to say… and notices the fine piece of jewlery he is holding out…and reacts..”for that-YEAH!”
it didnt work out
January 13, 2011 9:08 pm at 9:08 pm #728256WolfishMusingsParticipantFirstly, devarim she’b’leiv einum devarim, so if you manifest kiddushin it is irrelevant what you actually thought.
Secondly, if the couple was “assukin b’oso inyan” (of marriage), the gemara says we assume the money was given for kiddushin and accepted for kiddushin.
It’s also entirely possible that that’s the case only because that was the social convention at the time. As such, the bride and observers would have good reason to think the ring is being given for kiddushin.
Nowadays, however, the social convention is that everyone knows and understands that kiddushin takes place at the actual wedding itself. She knows it, he knows it and anyone observing it knows it. I still fail to see how it could be a kiddushin when neither party wants it to be one and neither party made any verbal declaration that it should be one.
The Wolf
January 13, 2011 9:11 pm at 9:11 pm #728257Sam2ParticipantYou guys are leaving out a second half of the discussion. Devorim Sheb’leiv Uv’leiv Kol Adam do count. Since everyone knows that it is customary nowadays to give a ring to a girl upon reaching an agreement to get married at a later date and that no one ever has in mind to accomplish Kiddushin by that giving of the ring, there should not be Kiddushin in such a case, even if two Kosher Eidim were present.
January 13, 2011 9:14 pm at 9:14 pm #728258popa_bar_abbaParticipantWolf and Sam:
You are saying much the same thing, Sam has the actual codification of the rule.
That sounds pretty good to me.
January 13, 2011 9:18 pm at 9:18 pm #728259WolfishMusingsParticipantYep. Sam said it much better than I.
The Wolf
January 13, 2011 9:28 pm at 9:28 pm #728260Sam2ParticipantSorry Wolf. I started writing my post before yours came up. I wasn’t trying to steal your idea or anything.
January 13, 2011 9:53 pm at 9:53 pm #728261WolfishMusingsParticipantSorry Wolf. I started writing my post before yours came up. I wasn’t trying to steal your idea or anything.
Don’t apologize. You did well… and you expressed the idea far better than I did.
The Wolf
January 13, 2011 9:57 pm at 9:57 pm #728262GabboimMember“Since everyone knows that it is customary nowadays to give a ring to a girl upon reaching an agreement to get married at a later date and that no one ever has in mind to accomplish Kiddushin by that giving of the ring”
Sam2: It isn’t customary by Jews to give a ring by the proposal. (Maybe it is by non-Jews.) The custom is to give a bracelet then.
January 13, 2011 10:12 pm at 10:12 pm #728263YW Moderator-80MemberRabbi Miller, tz’l was asked what the mekor was for giving a diamond ring for the engagement.
he said: “the jewelers”
he did say though that there is a mekor for giving a gift in the Gemorrah
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