Are the girls causing their own shidduch crisis??

I also wanted to comment on the original poster.

“Without a doubt there is certainly shortage of boys on the market. However in many instances I find the girls being overly demanding/choosy in what they are “looking for”. Such as “I only want someone with a plan” why in the world would a 24 year old learning boy need any more of a “plan” other then to learn and trust in hashem??”

There is an old joke about a girl’s father who meets his future son-in-law. He asks the boy how he plans to provide for his family. The boy answer’s “G-d will provide.” He asks how he plans to pay rent, bills, etc. and each time the boy answers “G-d will provide.” The father comes home and tells his wife “I’m glad that this boy thinks that I’m G-d.”

This story is apocryphal, and the point is that yes, G-d does provide, but money doesn’t usually rain down from the heavens. More often than not, in these situations, financial support is coming solely from the girl’s parents. Unless the parents are wealthy or have an outside source of income, this way of life is usually unsustainable in the long term. Therefore, many girls, out of a sense of RESPONSIBILITY and not wanting to burden their parents, want a boy who has some sort of plan. If a boy is in shidduchim, he should have some idea of how he is going to make it financially, without relying on his in-laws or his wife indefinitely.

‘And those who want working boys complain that he “isn’t serious enough about his learning”. Well yeah that is why he isn’t in Yeshiva and he his working with a “plan” as you wanted.’

Are “working” and “serious about learning” mutually exclusive? My father would be quite offended. There is a chiyuv on all men to be “koveia itim laTorah.” The mefarshim say that this means “asai Torascha keva u’melachtecha arai” – meaning, Torah should be the ikar, and the work tafel… regardless of how many hours are put in to each one.

“And for those of you living in Flatbush there is the new question “does he or doesn’t he wear a farragamo belt”. I’ll agree it’s a bit crazy to spend 360.00 dollars on a belt, but should that be a deciding factor in a shidduch?? (besides many of them are 10.00 dollar imitations).”

I agree that it shouldn’t be a “deciding factor” in a shidduch. However, the idea that someone would spend $360 on a belt says something about him (i.e. high maintenance). If I’m not looking for someone who’s high maintenance, maybe that will raise just a bit of a red flag.

From my end, my mother once said to me, “It’s not that a chup on a boy is a deal-breaker in a shidduch- it’s totally not- but I just can’t see you ending up with a boy who has a chup.” Chups happen to drive me crazy, but I’ve gone out with wonderful boys who have a chup. It’s obviously not a deal-breaker, but ultimately, the chup (in most cases) was somewhat representative of the differences in hashkafa/personality that we had.

“I recently heard a girl complain “I wouldn’t pay a penny to meet a shadchan”, really? why not?? does the shadchan owe you anything to spend hours and hours to try to find you someone–do you know of anyone that works for free?? (for the record i personally have never charged anyone or even accepted anything for any involvement in shidduchim).”

I agree with other posters- when do you ever pay someone if they don’t promise to do work for you? Will I shell out thousands of dollars for all the shadchanim I met who have never set me up??

chaya1

I agree on principle. I have B’H also seen that there are many good boys (and parents thereof) who are not particularly interested in external things such as money and looks.

I wish I could think of girls for those boys, actually… I just can’t:(

Why don’t you read my posts? I told you years ago that I read your posts, but I disagree with them.

You are saying that what Boaz did should be replicated. I am showing you from the gemara that you’re wrong.

Please don’t answer until you read my post!

DY -“I am showing you from the gemara that you’re wrong”

No. I proved already over there – that you’re the one that’s wrong!

It says Yalda – for sure not passed 13 y/o!

Even an old man can marry a 13 year old girl!

I laugh as I look at the first sentence of the OP.

Most young girls do not want to have to care for an elderly husband while still young themselves.

@Technical 20

“Do you know anyone who works for free?”

Yes, the losing attorneys who take contingency fee cases. It’s a common practice, the client only pays when you win.

BTW> I don’t practice that field of law.

As I’ve posted earlier, the initial meeting with the shadchan is you giving your time free to listen to the shadchan’s pitch as to why the shadchan should be engaged to perform a service. If you decide to use the service, then you pay.

Technical20

Yes, I am male.

I met with shadchanim more than 40 years ago when I was single.

I also met with them within the past dozen years as the parent of both boys and girls and rejected their services.

In the case of my daughters, they absolutely were making a sales pitch…it may have to do with my perceived income/status.

Technical20, the shidduch market is not a regulated market; no governing body has the authority to get involved and set prices. It’s also not value based; prices are not based on calculation of the actual cost of the service provided. You’re dealing with a free market where shadchanim take what the consumer is willing to give. I’m sure you’re familiar with supply and demand. Some people feel this system can be exploitative, and maybe it is. But so far it’s what we have. The choice of operating within the system or removing yourself from it, is yours.

I know you realize that ultimately your zivug doesn’t come from a human-based system anyway, although humans have been used for years, by The One orchestrating events, to facilitate the desired results.

Your first sentence is not true, which is not a stirah to your second sentence (which is partially true).

Then you need to clarify in a major way, because price is generally based on supply and demand. A retailer can’t raise his prices above market prices (for the market in which he’s competing in), on metalt’lin, but those prices are usually set by s&d, completely consistent with halachah.

A shadchan’s services, BTW, would not be subject to ona’ah.

“who has not provided her with a service.”

From the shadchans perspective, perhaps spending 30 minutes with you IS a service. Why is the shadchans time any less valuable than yours or mine? Perhaps we should take the analogy to a lawyer one step further. Perhaps if the shadchan was able to charge a $50 fee to meet with a young man or young lady he/she would have the resources to hire an assistant to help answer phone calls, emails, texts, mesages etc. As it is right now, for their initial free meeting all they get is kvetching, whining and complaining in forums such as these.

From the girl’s point of view, maybe spending thirty minutes with the shadchan is a service. Why is the girl’s time any less valuable than yours or mine?

The shadchan needs the girl or else he has nothing to offer the boys.

I think a lot of girls think they deserve a lot better that what they do deserve and dont agree to look down on something and accept that they to have issues which need to be looked down on.

Mr.Yidd -“Polygamy may not be illegal in a couple of years. And it’s not radical. For many people it is an ancient tradition”

This applies to you also – Could you just stop trying to convince girls to marry people they don’t want? If a girl feels that she would be unhappy if she marries that boy, why question that?

Practice what you Preach!!!

Polygamy is the practice of having more than one spouse, not of forcing girls to marry people they don’t want to marry. And I’m not sure what you mean by “practice what you preach”, because I don’t force girls to marry anyone and am not in a polygamous marriage.

I didn’t say you believe in forcing women to marry against their will. You seemed to imply that I don’t practice what I preach and that polygamy is against what I said. Since I am not in a polygamous marriage, “practice what you preach” doesn’t apply even if I said something anti-polygamy, which I did not.

“edited”

OK. Second most.

I know of some women who don’t care.

You don’t need more than a handful. Plus, that’s not even counting the women who prefer polygamy.

More girls would get married. And I’m not sure your solution wouldn’t cause a divorce crisis when the guy is 80 and the girl is still young.

Why would a 20 year old girl agree to marry a 40 year old guy? She’s still in the same parsha as guys in their 20s.

Health, would you marry a woman 20 years older than yourself?

Mr. Yidd -“Health, would you marry a woman 20 years older than yourself?”

Are you offering me one?