Well, after a long weekend, just a few comments,as my name has been mentioned a few times.
Dear zalman- I too have a job and I am not retired (for the ones who might know me-this is a real laugher). I do object to matisjohu writing something (about women/girls learning gemoro, for ex.) and then disappearing without backing it up. This is (in Rush Limbaugh’s words) akin to the ‘drive-by media”, a play on the horrid incidences of ‘drive-by’ murders. Chas vecholilo, I am not accusing matisjohu of drive-by murder-G-d forbid, but this is typical of people on this website making a wild statement and never bscking it up. I don’t know where he (Ma.) has disappeared to and maybe he will come back but for now, maybe it is incumbent upon YOU (who quoted him) to bring me some sources.Maybe it might make a good opportunity of looking into some Rambams. (there is a clue…)
As far as the discussion between Cantoresq and others, this debate has truly become sterile and futile. But it is absolutely true that many ( maybe not all) Hungarian Jews knew about Poland, the ghettos and the camps. This I know from MY father A”H who told me that there were numerous Jews who were able to flee Poland to Hungary ad told everyone: “me harget yidden- antloift!” (they are killing Jews, FLEE!). Amongst those who were in the middle of the Nazi persecutions and passed through Hungary include the Belzer rebbe and the Bilgurayer rebbe (his brother) and the Bobove rebbe. It is inconceivable to believe that they (and others) did not tell the Jews wherever they went that the Nazis were exterminating Yidden. Hungarian Jews knew but ,sadly, for whatever reason, did not fully react to the danger.
As for some other snide remarks- I,personally, have never attacked ANY Godol, Rebbe, Rov or Rosh yeshiva for their conduct pre-war or during its years. I try to adhere very closely to the maamar chazal: ” Al todin es chavercho at shetagya limkomo” We are ALL human beings and we can only make decisions based on what we see here and now and I sure have no idea how I would have reacted.
I have, however, also maintained that no Godol is infallible and the fact that their advice to many jews pre-war and during the war is proof that even they can make mistakes. By the way, there are numerous stories of Jews being told by their Rabbonim or rebbes not to leave Europe. Justc ask some survivors. It is not only a solitary letetr by Reb Elchonon Wasserman HY”D.
Lastly, I spell matisJohu and not MatisYohu because I think this is the correct way. It is Jom Hashishi, not Yom hashishi.