- This topic has 16 replies, 9 voices, and was last updated 7 years, 9 months ago by .
-
Posts
-
That’s what a rabbi said today in a shiur: Gentiles are atheists or polytheists. Monotheistic nonJews are Noahides.
Why didn’t anyone tell me this? Is this a common consensus?
I thought Gentile was another word for someone who is of another religion/nonJewish. I had no clue that it was describing someone’s specific beliefs.
Thank you
LB -this is a chiddush to me as well. I think it’s probably a matter of semantics.
I never heard the term Noachide used until relatively recently. I think that the term Gentile used to be the only term used for non-Jews.
I guess now that the term Noachide exists, some people have redefined the word Gentile. However, I am not sure that the definitions you were given make sense.
I think that in order to be a Noachide, one has to keep all 7 Mitzvos bnei Noach and be doing it because G-d said to (there may be other qualifications, but I don’t know).
What if someone only believes in One G-d but doesn’t keep all the other 7 Mitzvos? What would he be then?
Can you just ask the rabbi who said it to clarify?
Zoroastrianism is usually considered monotheistic, and Zoroastrians are not Noachides. And the dictionary definition of “gentile” is anyone who is not Jewish.
Islam is monotheistic, but I would find it hard to say that they fill all 7 Mitzvos bnei Noach.
WTP – lol, I was thinking of that. There may be some that do, but certainly many that don’t.
[gentile (n.) Look up gentile at Dictionary.com
“one who is not a Jew,” c. 1400; earlier “one who is not a Christian, a pagan” (late 14c.), from Late Latin noun use of Latin gentilis “of the same family or clan, of or belonging to a Roman gens,” from gens (genitive gentis) “race, clan” (see genus, and compare gentle).
The Latin adjective also meant “of or belonging to the same nation,” hence, as a noun, gentiles (plural) might mean “men of family; persons belonging to the same family; fellow countrymen, kinsmen,” but also “foreigners, barbarians” (as opposed to Romans), those bound only by the Jus Gentium, the “law of nations,” defined as “the law that natural reason establishes among all mankind and is followed by all peoples alike.”
The Latin word then was used in the Vulgate to translate Greek ethnikos (see ethnic), from ta ethne “the nations,” which translated Hebrew ha goyim “the (non-Jewish) nations” (see goy). Hence in Late Latin, after the Christianization of Rome, gentilis also could mean “pagans, heathens,” as opposed to Christians. Based on Scripture, gentile also was used by Mormons (1847) and Shakers (1857) to refer to those not of their profession. – etymonline]
Based on most of what’s stated here the word “Gentile” means “Nations” which would be an English translation for the word “Goyim”. Thus the word purely would mean “Non-Jew” when we as Jews use it. However, there is the ability to use the expression to allude to “pagans” even though that is not the strict meaning of the word.
I’m assuming that the Rabbi who made that statement distinguishing between “Gentiles” (pagans) and “Noahides” (believers in one G-d) was doing so in context of Halachah where a distinction many times exist, but often is misunderstood by laymen due to their not distinguishing between the two categories (“Gentiles” (pagans) and “Noahides” (believers in one G-d)). He was most likely trying to clarify that in Halachah the term “Gentile” is often referring to “Pagans”, not “Believers in one G-d”.
The word “gentile” ‘derives from Latin gentilis, which itself derives from the Latin gens … meaning clan or tribe” (Wikipedia). The word “goy” in Biblical Hebrew means “nation”. In fact, we are referred to as a goy kadosh. In Rabbinic Hebrew the word “goy” came to mean an idolater whereas a non-Jew who was not an idolater was called a ger toshav (without getting into the discussion regarding accepting them today). Ben Noach in the Gemara and Mishne Torah clearly is a general term for non-Jews. The Gemara (Megilla 13a) says that anyone who denies idolatry is called “Yehudi” (from meyahed – unite). In fact, the Gemara never refers to us a Yehudim (the use in Megillat Esther apparently refers to the fact that they were from Shevet Yehuda) but as Yisrael.
However, today the academic term “Noahide” has come to mean a non-Jew who has taken the sheva mitzvot upon himself. There are several Noahide organizations, each with its own website (you can google “Noahide” to find them).
LB, you really have to stop accepting what every rabbi says as the final word on the subject, especially, as in cases like this where he is merely expressing an opinion
Mormons call non Mormons gentiles
RY23, there’s certainly some question about the claim that Zoroastrianism is monotheistic. In some senses, it’s dualistic.
Lightbrite, according to Rambam (Hilchot Melachim 8,11) a righteous Noahide is someone who keeps the sheva mitvot because Hashem said so. A wise Noahide keeps them because he thinks that it is proper.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.