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Someone goes out with a supposedly top of the line guy – because he is frum, nice, great learner, strong hashkafos (okay, maybe not as much of a masmid as hed like to be) they discuss lots of stuff, he says how his parents dont let any videos in the house and he totally agrees with that. Anyway they get married and about 6 months later theyre in the public library for kosher reasons, and he picks up a movie. She doesnt know what to say, so she just cooperates. Nothing too bad, but not completely kosher either. Then he tells her that as a bochur he watched stuff in a friends house etc. He is not apologetic about it. He brings it home. They dont generally watch, but bein hazmanim, after a baby etc. he brings more home.
First of all, is this normal? Second, whats the best way for her to react?
Side note, she did grow up with movies ( mostly kosher), enjoys watching but does NOT want that for her family.
Normal, disappointing, deal with it.
Have a conversation about this with him. She should say what she really feels and hopefully he will be willing to talk.
He is testing her. It should be nipped in the bud. Maybe don’t fight but you can definitely stress how dissapointing it is to head in this direction.
normal, yes. How to react? An open honest conversation about it without accusations!
this is where we implement the good ol’ “I” messages;
“I feel confused, because I thought we agreed that this is not what we wanted in our home, can we talk about it?”
“I feel uncomfortable bringing that into our home; I’d like to discuss this before we continue to do so, can you tell me your take on the matter?”
wife should express how it makes HER feel, and then ask him to discuss his take on the matter. they have to communicate respectfully
I think they should get the “effective communications” video and watch it together.
Agree
normal, yes. How to react? An open honest conversation about it “without accusations”! and without both sets of parents involved! [or either]
If the movies are clearly inappropriate then you should communicate your dissatisfaction. If the movies are more benign, this could be the way your husband wants to spend time with you. Also, keep in mind that you have the power to sway your husband in what he watches with you and how often. For example, I’ll only watch A and not B, or only once a month.
Generally speaking, I would be more worried if he had access to unfiltered internet. It could be that watching movies from the library is his “kosher” alternative to other types movies which are available on the internet.
She should voice her opinion and do not get parents involved until after you talk because one side may forgive but a parent always remembers try to talk be open and say what she feels going to his rabbi is a plan b if talking has not resolved anything but people should talk and get it out and just because she grew up that way or he did does not mean its ok now if you guys make up your mind about something and one side starts changing then the other side should voice there concern if something religious-wise bothers you, you should voice your concern because small things tern into bigger things im not saying that i agree with watching movies of not all im saying is if something bothers you then voice your opinion and like others said try not to turn it into a fight
Sometimes in life one just had to do what my father always told me to do…”get over it!”
And It’s not so bad, it happens to all of us. My sister married a guy, top of the line also, than the first Wednesday of their marriage, a Jewish press comes in the mall!! NOW my parents grew up with it in my grandparents house, but nvr in my house!! And definitely not in my sister’s house! She was about to give up right them and there, but he agreed to getthe e-version, so the kids don’t see it
Oy vey!!!!! The Jewish Press?!?!?! Divorce him! A criminal! An animal! A sheigetz! Puuhhhhhhllleeeaasse!!!
Your husband has a yetzer hara like every other normal man and he will be tempted like any other man is to watch inappropriate things. The important thing for you to know is whether he at least acknowledges that this is something he should work on, but not that he should be perfect all the time.
Therefore, you should put your foot down to express your concerns, but at the same time you should offer your support to your husband in his fight against his temptations.
I watch movies, but if the guy told you he doesn’t watch movies and then you get married and now he does, then there is a problem. He lied to you about his hashkafah. Again, I think it’s totally fine to watch movies but once he lies to you about his hashkafah, then that’s not ok.
Ya. Let’s ask egg someone on to get divorced. That’s probably the right thing to do in this situation
Get divorced. He deserves better than you.
A relative of mine married thinking that he was a top guy,
being that she was a top girl she didn’t know what to do when she was shown otherwise.
my thoughts on such matters is that if the guy has nice middos, is a pleasant boy (generally around his in laws)than it doesn’t equal divorce…since that’s an essence of a human everyone wants a loving, caring, fun spouse yet if let down by the profile told to you than it takes time to move over and accept yet stay strong in area’s and beliefs.
Lets make a big deal out this. No surprise the word divorce was mentioned here. Blow this up and dont think of just having a plain old conversation. Sarcasm. pullleeeezz
It’s disappointing that this is considered normal, but lying in shidduchim isn’t unusual. Some people will say what they are expected to say and then act otherwise. Sometimes people like the shidduch so they don’t pick up on any red flags. Hard to know what really happened here, but it doesn’t sound like something to get divorced about. However, the wife should keep a keen eye on his behavior to see if anything else he told her were not true. Again, if he is decent, then she should be able to live with it and if i were she, i would not make a big deal over it. People change over time and you can’t hold them to certain thoughts and hashkfas for a lifetime
i think you should just ignore it yet if it happens again you can say really nicely i really dont want such things in our house. Also sometimes even the top guys feel that they need to relax a little theirs no reason to make a whole big deal if its a appropriate movie
This is more normal than the ‘system’ would like to admit.
The reason why it has become more normal nowadays is because today’s frum society is unfortunately way too restrictive in allowing our bochurim to do things they really enjoy and have talent with. (I cannot comment on the girls of today. but I think they have their own meshugasim, possibly including watching a movie or two as well). How many shtark bochurim do you know that can have hobbies when they are holed up in the yeshiva the entire day? (Disclaimer: I am talking about the bochurim who shouldn’t be there all day when I use the term “holed up.”) Even during bein hasedarim (which, combined, might mean 4-5 hours over the course of the day/night), you won’t find too many boys today who are playing instruments, going for a jog or playing ball, working a small side job, reading interesting kosher books, or anything productive (remember: for 90% of bochurim, especially those who are 17, 18, 19, college is out of the question).
If a boy wants to get into playing an instrument, or a jog, or chess, or something, too often he is put down because of it. Instead, it is seen as better that boys should be learning 100 hours a day – even though 90% of boys are not cut out for this at all. This is why I think that boys should be allowed to go to kosher colleges, such as Touro, etc… (or even secular colleges depending on the boy). It is not a healthy environment for the boys to be hanging around in their dorms all day. We have often segregated the yeshivas who do more extra-curricular stuff as lacking, but the truth is that many of the more yeshivish yeshivas could benefit from having something for boys to do in their downtime. Is it so bad that the boy takes a couple of courses for a few hours twice a week, or maybe works as a lifeguard a couple of hours a week, or volunteers a couple of hours a week, etc…
Many guys will tutor other boys, but usually it’s the real top boys who are doing this.
When you are in a yeshiva all day, and one with a dorm, and nothing else to do but learn, that is why you see boys picking up these dangerous and destructive habits such as smoking, drinking, and watching movies or inappropriate material.
This is all coming from someone who knows the system very well. I do think that it is more common than people think for a bochur/yungerman to enjoy a movie sometimes, but maybe the issue is that the “top bochurim” of today doesn’t mean as much as it used to – because everyone nowadays goes to yeshiva in Lakewood, Mir, etc… – so you will obviously find it to be more prevalent now.
In short, the point of this post is to say that this type of behavior is more normal than you think, but it’s not necessarily indicative of so much. The fact that a guy learns in kollel does not tell you anything about the guy. The average quality of a yungerman 20 years ago as compared to today is starkly different, both because of the moral decline of society, and because there are too many mediocre boys in full-time learning for too long, that they water down the chashivus of our outstanding young future Rebbeim, who are truly amazing for what they can accomplish.
A relationship is based on honesty and trust. If something is bothering her she should find the right way to approach her spouse. Maybe at the time that he told her no movies he meant it and the circumstance s changed since. They should have an open and honest conversation with eachother or she will never know and harbor these bad feelings which is definitely not healthy for the relationship. As a couple I am sure they respect eachother and will try their hardest to make sure to work it out smoothly and clarify the situation.
The words divorce “him”are foreign to Jewish vernacular. The man divorces the woman, not vice versa. I guess a man should expect his wife to be addicted to her smartphone, but if he should glance at a movie, instant divorce is apropos. And don’t even think about visitation rights, let alone custody. I have little hope for the future of Jewish womankind.
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