In honor of Yom Haatzmaut. By popa–RETRACTED

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  • #609040
    popa_bar_abba
    Participant

    Now I’ll say something nice.

    People have a tendency to take things which they feel connected to, and associate them with something else which they feel much more connected to. I don’t know why–perhaps it is because we want to imagine it is all part of a cohesive whole, or perhaps we think it will lend importance and meaning to first thing.

    For example, Americans like to imagine that baseball is American. That apple pie, and barbeques and hot dogs are American. That there is somehow some patriotic meaning to rooting for the Yankees. They are taking the pastime they like and giving it importance or meaning by attaching it their feelings of being American. (Note well the sign on Yankee stadium today standing united with the Red Sox–baseball=american.)

    And when we do that, we choose something which we feel very emotionally connected to, and which is very important, and probably uniting, and that is the idea to which we attach our smaller stuff.

    So I might not agree with the Dati Leumi interpretation of the state of Israel as an event of and object of religious significance. As much as I am glad that it exists, and as much as I related emotionally to the state. But I note well that when the dati (and even many non-religious) want to choose something important to which to attach their feelings about the state of Israel–they choose yidishkeit. And that is something I recognize them for.

    #946010
    Torah613Torah
    Participant

    ????? in honor of ??? ???????. I agree and value the Dati Le’umiim for their valuation of Israel as a religious entity. I hope everyone has a wonderful day barbecuing and flying flags and ignoring it and listening to speeches.

    #946011
    popa_bar_abba
    Participant

    I’m retracting this.

    I realized it is incorrect, and also offensive. See, I am doing exactly what I always get upset at non-religious people for. I am ascribing genuine religious belief to sociological theories.

    So for the record, I do believe that your beliefs on this issue are founded on genuine religious belief, and I do not think they are related to the above theory. And I apologize.

    #946012
    Torah613Torah
    Participant

    How is this offensive? People are always coming up with sociological arguments for other’s beliefs, and that’s fine.

    I think it is more offensive to say that you think that they are genuinely just wrong, even if it is more truly your opinion.

    #946013
    popa_bar_abba
    Participant

    No, I don’t think that’s fine.

    #946014
    Torah613Torah
    Participant

    What’s wrong with it?

    #946015
    popa_bar_abba
    Participant

    Well, exactly what I said. I am accusing the Dati leumi rabbonim of having the hashkafa they do for reasons besides that they legitimately and genuinely think it is correct al pi torah. That is offensive, and almost certainly incorrect.

    It is like when people say that chareidi rabbonim have the opinions they do because of some ulterior motive. Like when they say that the agunah problem is because the rabbis don’t care enough to make it muttar, etc.

    #946016
    yitayningwut
    Participant

    good man

    #946017
    OneOfMany
    Participant

    *good perhaps a man

    #946018
    Torah613Torah
    Participant

    Thank you for explaining.

    #946019
    Brony
    Participant

    plz explain why you deny sociology brother. the lady doth protest too much.

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