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We all know that there are many places in davening that it is assur meikur hadin to talk by. Many times nebach I see people mouthing words, or even worse whispering, as far as I’m concerned this is not any worse than talking straight out. Am I wrong, or are they wrong?
Both.
You are NOT wrong. Isn’t it sad?
Talking during davening or laining is wrong on two different levels:
1. It’s disturbing to other daveners.
2. It’s disrespectful to the davening and the One to whom we are davening.
On the first level, whispering is not as bad as outright talking, since it’s less disturbing. On the second level, it is just as bad.
The Wolf
In our city we had many scary things happen in a weird pattern that made it obvious that there was something very wrong. When someone went to different rabbeim in E”Y for brachos and explanations, a rav said this might have happened because there is too much talking during davening in so many places.
Wolf – Another problem is a hefsek.
During certain parts of davening, that’s true. During others it’s not.
If it will make you feel any better, then I will amend my answer to state that on one level it’s worse and on two levels it’s not.
The Wolf
The problem today is not mainly abt talking anymore, its a new heter of browsing internet in ur bb and sending emails and txts during davening!
When we Daven it is like we all have a telephone line to Hashem. Anyone who talks during davening breaks that connection and the whole minyan suffers. DON’T DO IT! There is nothing so important that cannot wait till after Davening.
Wolf – Look back at my OP where i wrote assur meikur hadin, where I was refering to these cases, sorry I didn’t state hefsek.
OK, so then my answer still stands:
On the levels of disrespect for davening and hefsek, it makes no difference whether one whispers or talks. On the level of disturbing others, whispering is not as bad as outright talking.
The Wolf
I like talking during davening.
There are plenty of times that it isn’t assur to talk, and during davening is when I have a chance to see my friends.
When I was in yeshiva, we used to talk straight through kaballas shabbos. The whole thing. The more singing, the more time for talking.
(Wolf: Can I be a bigger rasha than you now?)
real-brisker,
Sorry I couldn’t elaborate in my post; I was in the middle of aleinu. ?
You’re right that it’s bad, you’re wrong in your choice of words “as far as I’m concerned this is not any worse than talking straight out.”
You probably meant that it’s no better. (Although you’re right that it’s technically just as bad, it is not as disruptive (as Wolf said), and it also shows some level of embarrassment, which is better than someone not even acknowledging that it’s wrong.)
pba,
Al tifrosh min hatzibbur. If the tzibbur is singing praise to Hashem and glorifying His Shabbos, you shouldn’t be shmoozing. (Nor should I be shmoozing.)
what we really need is a topic called ”Davening during Davening”
that’s the way it should be!
Anyone who talks, should be thrown out , no chances!!!
OY Vey. While speaking to your boss, or your Rebba, or an important client would you interrupt and speak to someone else???
popa: Even when you’re allowed to talk m’ikar hadin, you’re still disturbing other people. If we –that is any of us — want to shmooze during korbanos (there should be another thread discussing why so many shuls don’t say them) we should do it in back.
DY – My question was based on hefsek as I noted later, so then I assume it isn’t any better off.
Why should the discussion be limited to hefsek? Life’s not so simple, there are almost always multiple things to consider.
Anyone who talks, should be thrown out , no chances!!!
Oh please, just one more chance?? Please?
Because its halacha.
So is bein adam lachaveiro.
I don’t know why you did not post my previous entry on this thread, but talking during the silent prayer Amidah is an evil thing to do and brings evil into the congregation. This is an absolute no no. Sadly, there are always numerous people who talk immediately after they do their davening without waiting for the time of silent prayer to conclude. I really wish this stopped. I spoke about it a few times at my synagogue and guess what, I am no longer welcome in the shul anymore. Thats how the wickedness propegates. Thanks.
I am wondering if this post is for real. To my understanding it is against halacha to speak at anytime during tefilla.
If one goes to shul to talk, where does he go to daven?
My mother, who B”H is of age was in shul sometimes before it opened. The mechitza was where the front rows was for the women and back for the men, where the shmusers were. My mother would always bang on the tables and say sh-sh. There was one man who especially was upset and said,”what does she want, she is almost smelling the grass”. Well my mother is B”H still with us here,but that man unfortunately has grandchildren carrying his name that were long bar mitzvahed.
To basket of radishes, you did what was right and continue doing so. Obviously that shul is not a real makom tefilla if you are not welcome there and take it as a blessing in disguise.
People talk and all of a sudden when a catastrophe hits they start banging their heads against the wall. We must speak to Hashem all the time and shul is a place meant for davening.
Besides the great averia of talking during davening,one has to realize that he is Chotei UmachtI.
In Addition, he is being mevatel the mitvo of answerng Omein which the Sifri says in Haazinu, is DeOraysa!!!
See the Netziv in Haamek Shaalo.
The SiDur Hachida, brings down that when a person taks during Magen Ovos on Friday night,
his punishment is that after his Petira the malochim lift him up very high, and then let go.
The Zohar CHodosh on Rus, says that that if a person misses an Omein, he is burnt in the 3rd level of Gehinnom.
The Levush was once put into cherem by his Rebbi, for missing an Omein to a childs brocho!!
Rabbosai, be zohir!!!!!
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