The split in the Eida Chareidis seems to be growing since Asra Kadisha feels there is ongoing Chilul Kevarim due to the psak halacha of Ravaad Eida Chareidis HaGaon HaRav Moshe Sternbuch Shlita, which differs from the psak of Eida Chareidis Gavaad HaGaon HaRav Yitzchok Tuvia Weiss Shlita. For the elders of the Eida community, it is clear Rav Weiss is afraid to publically challenge the zealots, who in many ways have taken control of aspects of the Eida community and operation.
The unacceptable actions of the so-called sikrikim against the Ravaad are become increasingly frequent and bold, openly accusing him of being responsible for chilul kevarim. Similar attacks have been seen against leaders of Toldos Aaron and Dushinsky including protests during his visit to Europe.
Last motzei Shabbos the ongoing split was evident again as the Ravaad was verbally assaulted during a levaya.
A cellular telephone belonging to one of the sikrikim fell and the WhatsApp program that is installed revealed their plot against all those who disagree with them. A recording signaled the fanatics planned to attack the Toldos Aaron Rebbe Shlita last week in London during a protest against him. They refer to Toldos Aaron as the “Murderous cult”.
Recordings verify their disdain and how they make a mockery of HaGaon HaRav Shmuel Auerbach Shlita and his followers, and how they plan to assault Meir Porush and Beit Shemesh Mayor Moshe Abutbul.
One can only imagine how far this will lead R”L and what action if any is being taken to halt the actions of these irresponsible individuals before chas v’sholom a tragedy occurs.
(YWN – Israel Desk, Jerusalem)
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24 Responses
The guy at WhatsApp? Seriously? Why do I find this hard to believe?
**The guy had…
what do you mean “Rav Weiss is afraid to publicly challenge them” They are protesting because they are siding with Rav Weiss against Rav Shternbach. So let Rav Weiss approve a Pashkivil stating that he’s against the violence. To me it seems “shtika kihodaah!”
Send them to Syria!!
What’s app, yeah big sikrik
JMaybe they are bored. Remember they boycott zionist elections, so while everyone else in Israel in enjoying what is basically a ten week Purim-spiel, they have nothing to keep themselves amused.
Most kehillos do not want to confront or combat the “extremists”. They serve a purpose as a mouthpiece or reminder of a silent voice that is always underlying & validated by a tiny minority.
The Eidah has never wanted to silent these “eruptions”. It has gotten more vocal, more violent & more untamed. So what to do now is proven impossible!
from the beginning, the whole tradition of eida-netura karta- satmar was KANAUS. they even attacked the saintly rav kook Z”L. they created a frankenstein monster and now they have to deal w/it
As my Rav once said – when you assur things that are muttar, pretty soon you will be making things muttar that are assur. No better evidence of that than here.
Long Island Yid, I imagine that if he did that, these bullies would probably find some excuse to go at him as well. He is human and I’m not sure I would have done anything different in his position.
Who are we to judge?
Everyone should have in mind in the brocho Sim Shalom that Hashem should make peace among all His children.
Why does YWN have to report such stories. It seems to me you are just fanning the flames of machlokes. Anyone who knows Harav Toivia Weiss knows that he is aidel and refined to the extreme. He definately does not approve of those hoodlums but there is little he can do. In every community one finds drop outs who make a bad name for them all. By publicizing stories of this nature you are making things worse!
We have the sikrikim and they have ISIS. Rav Weiss is afraid to publicly challenge the sikrikim as the muslim leaders are afraid to challenge their extremists, who in many ways have taken control of aspects of the muslim community.
@BABAKAMA – First of all, both the Aida and Satmar disavowed themselves from the NK long ago. Secondly, this should be a lesson to all what happens when an individual, group of individuals, or even a pseudo-organized group have no Rav, Rebbe, posuk, etc. to whom they ask and from whom they take direction. Thirdly, Rav Kook was respected by all in Yerushalayim,for his chochmah, his avodah, his chesed, and his midos (including Rav Yosef Chaim, Rav Aryeh Levin, the Baal HaLeshem (Rav Elyashev’s grandfather), Rav Isser Zalman Meltzer, and many more). The ONLY points of contention were his shitah and his becoming Chief Rabbi.
Violence from the Eida Ha’ra’a, and their leadership doesn’t condemn it? Shocking!!! Who’d have thunk it?
#3 Long Island Yid has it right – they want to be able to pressure their opponents with the violence/threat thereof, while maintaining plausible deniability. We used to call that the “Yasser Arafat method of negotiating”.
an Israeli Yid
shuali, sorry to dissapoint you but what you wrote is not the fact. Satmer very much vilified Rav Kook. In Satmer’s book anyone being vocally pro Zionist is equal to an apikoros since the antiZionism for Satmer = Yiddishkeit and pro Zionism = equals apikorses.
I love Satmer Chassidim and all frum, eidel people, including Eidah Charedis. They themselves are very warm and generally very eidel. HOWEVER being not being accepting that others have different shittas, has created a monster that is growing out of control. These include Sikrikim and NK, which Satmer is NOT against, they just don’t go to those extremes. Kaanuas (all l’Shem Shomayim, of course)HAS created this huge and growing out of cobtrol MONSTER. This reminds me of the time before the churban where Jews, committed acts of violence, all l’shem Shamayim of course!
Akuperma #6: The Eida is a political party — that doesn’t vote. And though they don’t vote, they are as involved as nearly every other Israeli is in the elections, following the endless back and forth of the polling, who said what when, etc. And don’t you doubt it for a moment. On election day, right after they are publicly mekabel ol malchus shaymayim in front of the Eida’s headquarters building, very many scurry home to flip on their radios (maybe nowadays smartphones, who knows?) to check on the latest voting results.
Incidentally, it’s a pretty well known secret that most of the kanoim, sikrikim, and and related types in Yerushalayim have too much time on their hands. And before anyone starts in with the usual response, let me say that most of these types would make terrible soldiers. So forget any thoughts about “channeling their energies” into the IDF. The army doesn’t even dream of drafting these guys — and for good reason.
I don’t understand why Satmar is the issue here. The rabbanim from Brisk and elsewhere, who lived both in and out of E”Y, including the saintly Chazon Ish, were all quite vocal and clear that Zionism was and is rabidly anti-Torah and (therefore) anti-Jewish. Speaking of the Chofetz Chaim, he was also strongly against Zionism and that was well before Israel’s founding.
As to Rabbi Kook, his ideas and philosophies (including any other form of Zionism) were roundly condemned by the Torah greats from (in ABC order) Chassidic to German to Litvish from the 19th century and on. Even the MO know and admit that Rabbi Kook’s nationalist philosophies are closely paralleled in secular sources (and Nationalism was quite popular at that time) and the Torah sages were quite clear that these ideas are very much kineged the Torah.
What I find even more astounding, though, is that someone here compared these misguided “sikrikim” to, lihavdil, ISIS?!
american_yerushalmi :
1. Boycotting an election isn’t as much fun as campaigning. And the issue they are fighting over is trivial compared to bigger issues (conscription, communal autonomy, war and peace, etc.), which suggests to me they are bored. If there ever is an “aktion” to round up hareidim, they’ll forget about dead bones of question origins and switch to breaking people’s bones – though the polling suggests that whomever wins the election will need hareidi support, to be purchased by cancelling conscription.
2. Hareidim would make horrible soldiers since they would always regard halacha as more imortant than military orders, and would ask “Is what we doing more important than the mitzvah to stay alive”. Much of zionist socialization for the last century has been devoted to convert all the Jews from hareidim (which they were in the recent past) into good zionist soldiers who follow orders.
3. The whole issue of conscription is about the hareidim. The army may see it as a nightmare if they get drafted (no army wants inherently disloyal soldiers) but the zionist parties see conscription as a solution to the very real threat of Torah Judaism displacing zionism in Eretz Yisrael.
@philosopher – Please reread my comment. The disagreement was in shita as you also write. That is true. Not accepting the other’s shita, has nothing to do, however, with respecting, loving, helping, or supporting them. The Satmar Rav gave money to the needy no matter what type, style, or color yarmulkeh they wore. That is well known. Beis Shamai did not refrain from marrying into Beis Hillel in spite of very serious differences in shita and halachah. Loving, caring, accepting, trusting, etc. does not mean, cannot mean, compromising on shita or halachah. That would either be hypocritical or discount the shita.
to convert all the Jews from hareidim (which they were in the recent past)
Have you researched the history of Jews in Poland & Russia? There was a larger contingent of secular Jews in Munkatch than Torah Jews.
“The rabbanim from Brisk and elsewhere, who lived both in and out of E”Y, including the saintly Chazon Ish, were all quite vocal and clear that Zionism was and is rabidly anti-Torah and (therefore) anti-Jewish.”
Not true. Rabbi Moshe Soloveitchik, son of Rabbi Chaim and father of Rabbi Yosef Dov, taught in Zionist schools for the last two decades of his life. Rabbi Yosef Dov became the leader of Mizrachi. Rav Kook has already been mentioned, and other unquestionable Zionist gedolim include Rav Herzog,
“The rabbanim from Brisk and elsewhere, who lived both in and out of E”Y, including the saintly Chazon Ish, were all quite vocal and clear that Zionism was and is rabidly anti-Torah and (therefore) anti-Jewish.”
Not true. Rabbi Moshe Soloveitchik, son of Rabbi Chaim and father of Rabbi Yosef Dov, taught in Zionist schools for the last two decades of his life. Rabbi Yosef Dov became the leader of Mizrachi. Rav Kook has already been mentioned, and other unquestionable Zionist gedolim include Rabbis Reines, Herzog, Uziel, Aviner, and Lichtenstein. Towards the end of his life Rabbi Ovadia Yosef also admitted that he was a Zionist and he had the Shas party join World Mizrachi.
There is very little in differences between the shittas of Satmar, Brisk, Agudas Yisroel, Chazon Ish, Steipler, the Chofetz Chaim, etc. They all stringently opposed zionism and statehood. The only differences were what to do about it after the fact once the zionist state was de facto created. Satmar, Brish and some others said to ignore it or fight it and certainly not join its political process. Agudas Yisroel and others said as bad as it is and as much as we oppose it, we need to be part of its political process in order to protect our rights.