Reply To: Flag Parade and Our Jewish Values

Home Forums Decaffeinated Coffee Flag Parade and Our Jewish Values Reply To: Flag Parade and Our Jewish Values

#2095628
y1836
Participant

There is a world of a difference between having national pride and shouting “death to the Arabs”, and harassing them. While Religious Zionists celebrate Israel only a minority fringe segment chants hate messages, and fighting with the Arabs. These actions are generally condemned by many leaders in the Dati Liumi world. Rav Aharon Lichtenstien, a very influential Rav in the DL world condemned in the strongest terms these types of things. As do many leaders in that world.

Yserbius123- i don’t think you’re right that having a state is Kneged Hatorah. Certainly the secular nature of the state is terrible and we have to try to make it as religious as possible. There is no excuse to use violence against innocent people. The state of israel however, was looked at a gift from Hashem by many Gedolim. The secular Zionists intended it as a way of replacing religion Rl, which was terrible. Nevertheless, many Gedolim viewed it as a Berachah, even if the founders had bad intentions. Here are some examples of Gedolim’s views.
The Ponivitzer Rav didn’t say Tachanun on YH, clearly viewing The State of Israel as a happy event. He also supported hanging an Israeli flag on The Yeshivah on YH, a practice continued to this very day.
Rav Dessler (Michtav Mieliyahu, volume 3, page 352) writes about the miracle of The State of Israel. He criticizes those who are blind from seeing the the miracle.
Rav Isser Zalman celebrated the founding of the state of Israel, as testified by his Talmid, Rav Reuven Katz.
Rav Ovadya Yosef (Yabia Omer, Chelek Vav, Teshuvah Mem or Mem Aleph), writes how he can’t hide from all the good things which have occoured from the State of Israel.
In a footnote to Emes Liyyakov (Parshas Bo), they quote that Rav Yaakov considered the State of Israel to be a way of Hashem strengthening Jewish identity after the Holacaust.
The Tzitz Eliezer in his Hakadamh to his Sefer Hilchos Medinah writes about the great Chesed of Hashem in bringing the Jewish people back to EY (with the founding of the state of Israel.
Rav SF Mendelovitz was very excited about the UN proposal for a state and made a Shechiyany on it. (See one of the last chapters of Artscroll biography of him).
Rav Tzvi Pesach Frank viewed the State positively, according to testimony from a Talmid.
Rav Elya Meir Bloch, Rosh Yeshivas of Telz, co-hosted a YH event with Mizrachi. He writes a letter justifying it in which he writes that the mere existence of the state of Israel is of great significance, and that Aguda’s “war” against the secular goverment is not targeted against the state itself which is a good thing.
Rav Zevin, Rav Herzog, Rav Yosher Ber Soleveitzik, and Rav Aharon Solleveichik among other Gedolim celebrated YH. I know they weren’t associated so much with the Chareidi world, but they were nevertheless big Talmidei Chachomim and Gedolim and recognized as such by many of the Chareidi Gedolim (For example Rav Aharon Kotler eulogized Rav Herzog as “Sar Hatorah”)
Certainly, many Gedoim disagreed with these views. Examples include the Chazon Ish, Rav Shach, The Brisker Rav among others. The fact remains however that many Gedolim viewed did in fact consider the state of israel to be a positive thing, not a bad thing which we have to accept after the fact.