KY
“i dont believe it is the outlook in the torah”
when it comes to bein adom lechaveiro why would the severity of the act be determined by the Torah.?
Just like there is no passuk that says stealing a poor man’s sheep is worse than a rich. It is something you know.
Is it kenegged the Torah to be more outraged by a person who stole a poor man’s only sheep than one of the rich man’s dozen?
” The distinction between what the Troah would want in ideal world with no feelings” and the world we live in where our thoughts are perception of slight is framed by western thought is not a real division. It is one you contrived.
Its not like well ideally the poor person wouldn’t care so much and Dovid Wouldn’t have been so strict but he caved to Western (or its equivalent) pressure.
For example. Is there anything inherently wrong in making a certain gesture with a finger that is widely considered offensive? If someone did it to in the dor hamidbar I doubt anybody would have batted an eyelash. Yet today, I’m sure you agree making such a gesture to anybody certainly an adum chashuv is an averia . Why? Just because western society tells us that it is rude?
Yes!
Or going back to my last example. If I destroy a family heirloom that has no market value, do you think my act is less severe than stealing a few bucks?
Or the example I keep giving, could it really be that maiming someone is less severe an act than hitting?
If you say yes,In the ideal Torah world , ie based on the Torah’s outlook, hitting is more severe than maiming, destroying something a person values that cant be marketed is not that big an aveira, and stealing a poor man’s sheep is just as bad as a rich ones.
then MAYBE I could hear your tzad.
but that doesnt seem plauisible, the Torah was meant for people, with feelings and emotions yes beis din shel matah can’t always punish based on these external factors, but that doesnt change how severe the aveira is. . yes punishments generally are more severe for more severe acts, but this is not always true.
“that has been my point all along that we have been mushpa from western thought”
Of course but that isnt necessarily bad.
(I’m gonna ignore this comment “but in a pristine torah only world it would not be that way” That in a pristine world girls shouldnt mind being ne’nas and just get over it to paraphrase IITFT’s comment that I’m not sure who it is directed against becaue I’d rather end on a high note. )