Members of Neturei Karta who arrived at Ponevezh Yeshiva in Bnei Brak to protest the annual flying the flag on Independence Day were not greeted warmly as they hoped, but were ousted and sent on their way.
The sikrikim arrived to protest against the yeshiva’s minhag to fly the Israeli flag atop the yeshiva building, but talmidim were less than pleased to see them. The talmidim were prepared for their arrival and quickly surrounded them until the message was received. They left in shame with the realization their presence was unwanted.
One talmid, Avi, quoted by Kikar Shabbos stated that “we aren’t Zionists but we remain committed to continue the minhag that was started by the founder of the yeshiva, HaGaon HaRav Kahanaman ZT”L.”
(YWN – Israel Desk, Jerusalem)
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17 Responses
good!!!! let that be a lesson for those neturei karta, what a bunch of idiots, anyone who supports hamas and the like deserve to be put to…and kudos to the bochurim in ponevevezh yeshiva for standing up to whats right!!!
They tried to get into the building and tear down the flag. This is what the bochorim blocked them from doing. But they continued remaining out in front protesting the flag and making a maacho for a few hours.
Do the zionists realize how great a conciliatory gesture this was by the yeshiva. If the zionists don’t realize this, and reciprocate, don’t be shocked next year if their is a change of minhag. Remember that the zionist press believes that except for Neturei karta and Satmar (and groups like them), the Hareidi yeshivos will start emptying out soon as their students trade in the gemaras for rifles.
Will the zionists see their flag being flown at Ponevezh as a sign of surrender (as in “yes, we finally realize the need to cut back on Torah and Mitsvos for the sake of the medinah”) or as an “olive branch” (as in “we will oppose conscription, but don’t force us to become your enemies).
“were not greeted warmly as they hoped” Why did they hope to be greeted warmly?
A complete disregard and understanding of the Litvish Olem of Bnei Torah — Go Neutri Karta and learn ‘derachaha darchai noam”
I looked in allot of poskim but can’t find the source where this minhag comes from. Can someone please write the name of the sefer that brings this minhag?
The minhag is called “hakaras hatov”to the soldiers who died so yeshivas could continue to learn and thrive. It has nothing to do with zionist beliefs and probably mirrors american jews who fly american flags on july 4th as hakoras hatov to medina she’ll chesed of america
To #6 who said “The minhag is called “hakaras hatov”to the soldiers who died so yeshivas could continue to learn and thrive.”
Israels soldiers did not die so yeshivas could continue to learn and thrive. If that’s all the Israelis wanted, they could have agreed to make Palestine into an American Trust Territory – meaning the Jews there would have the shallow or materially deprived lives similar to the Jews of such awful places as Lakewood, Monsey, Williamsburg and Boro Park. They died to make Israel into a secular state where Jews could be free to live their lives while being free from the yoke of Torah. From an Israeli perspective, as is very clear in the secular press, the growth of the yeshivos was an unfortunate result from a serious mistake they made in 1949 when they could have easily closed down the yeshivos.
It is easier to argue that the Allies fought World War II to save European Jews – and that’s a stretch. Revulsion over Nazi anti-Semitism, even among Anglo-American anti-semities, was a major factor in the decision to reject Hitler’s terms (leaving American and Britain untouched, with their armies and territories intact. Also has the Allies chosen to make peace (in 1940 for Britain, and to stay out the war for the US at the same time), it would have been very bad for European Jews. On the other hand, had the Israelis made peace in 1947, it would have been bad for the secular socialists, but frum Jews in Israel would have been content to live under the Stars and Stripes.
#5, #6 , # 7
The ‘hakarat hatov’ is for the abundance of funds, grants, discounts, tax abatements, land allotments, etc. given to the yeshiva by the Israeli government. Therefore the yeshiva is showing that we are grateful and a subsidiary of the government by the financial kindness and goodness that we received. This is what Rav Kahaneman stood for whether in Europe or Israel….thanks is the word of the day!!
This is NOT the minhag of Rav Kahaneman!!
On one particular occasion, when NK was protesting the flying of the zionist flag at Ponevezh, R’ Kahaneman was asked “why don’t you do something about this? Why don’t you nake sure they din’t come?” He responded “If they wouldn’t come on their own, I would pay them to come! I want everyone to know that what I’m doing is only bedieved – not the right way to do things, but necessary because of the difficulty of the times.”
THAT was his minhag (and why NK expected a warmer reception)
#5
They knew what to expect – the same thing happens every year. I don’t know why it’s news.
And they themselves are mostly part of the “Litvish Olem of Bnei Torah”, many of them or their relatives learned in Ponevizh (I know from my own family).
Not everything in Ponevizh goes with Darkei Noam, vehameivin yovin.
“decision to reject Hitler’s terms”
Hitler never really offered “terms”. He and Mussolini declared war on the US on December 11, 1941, and the back-channel negotiations never resulted in anything serious other than the orderly surrender of the Nazi armies after the death of Hitler yemach shmo.
“had the Israelis made peace in 1947”
There was no formal “peace” offer in 1947 either. The leader of the Arabs of Palestine was a fugitive for war crimes who had recruited for the SS!
“content to live under the Stars and Stripes”
What in the world does this mean?
PLEASE SEE GEMORA SANHEDRIN
חלק פרק אחד עשר סנהדרין צח.
אמר רבי חמא בר
חנינא
אין בן דוד בא עד שתכלה מלכות
הזלה מישראל
RASHI
עד שתכלה מלכות הזלה.
שלא תהא להם שוס שולטנות לישראל
אפילו שולטנות קלה ודלה:
You give hakaras hatov to your state. Even Jews that live in America should have the American flag showing outside their house on July fourth. Any Jews that don’t have an American flag hanging outside their house (on July 4th) is making a chillul Hashem. No matter how “immoral” America is, the fact that they are a “medinah shel chesed” by allowing us to learn Torah etc. is a reason to put up a flag.
While we’re on the subject of Hakoras Hatov why don’t we as Jews who live in a country with the most freedom ever afforded us, fly the American flag on July 4th and Memorial Day?
To kuperman
You have chutzpah and should be ashamed to say that the kedoshim who died defending Israel died to make Israel a secular state where Jews could live free of Torah. I’m shocked YWN published your offensive comment and that no one else took offense at your rude callousness
The mere fact that this is done by only one ‘ haredi’ yeshiva is a clear statement.
Akuperman,I am sorry to say I just lost all respect I had for you. How can you say that the soldiers died to make israel a secular state? They died protecting the country from those who swore they would kill every last jew in israel. Whether or not those in charge may have had that in mind is another story. But the soldiers themselves were following the orders, to protect everyone living here. Please use some sechel before putting down the people who risk their lives to protect yidden on a daily basis.