getitclear:
Your post is appreciated despite our disagreement. It is polite, and for a subject under debate in the CR, that is an accomplishment. I see things quite opposite, and I have major comments on your post. As we are all in this emotionally, I will try to emulate your decency in responding.
Several points you made deserve challenge. I find them highly irritating (the content, not the delivery). I will try to list some of these individually.
* “So if the government and vaccine producers can limit your fear of disease, and assure your well being, you will choose to follow their advice, innovations and promises.” – This point is untrue. The government is not trying to allay fears. It is trying to eradicate disease. And studies show it has fared quite well. There is a great track record of eliminating quite a few diseases, and greatly reducing the incidence of others.
* “I believe all you parents who go to the doctor to vaccinate have the best intentions in mind, and of course you don’t take your doctor’s word with certainty when he says vaccines are very safe, safer than the disease.
I believe you take the time to read disease facts. I believe you have the courage to ask your doctor to show you the vaccine package insert, so you can read the adverse side effects related to the vaccine your child is about to receive.
I believe your doctor is honest and lawfully hands that to you, the consumer. I believe you read it….I believe you discuss your concerns and take the time to make a conscious choice to allow your doctor to administer the vaccine to you dear child.” – This is the sarcasm that serves as the emotional cover for the intellectual weakness of the arguments. We vaxxers rely on the government to do the research for us. We entered this world observing the successes of vaccinating, and do not engage in the scientific study of a subject that lies outside our domain of learning and experience. That’s the role of government. Once again, we openly saw the devastation of various illnesses and how they vanished once there was widespread vaxxing.
* “I’m sure you know our country was founded on the belief of freedom. I’m sure you agree that as humans we should have freedom of choice.” – Nice sales pitch. That’s why we chose to vaccinate and you chose not to. That freedom is yours. No one ever entered your home and threatened you with criminal charges over your decision to not vaccinate. I might have an ideological issue with your exercise of parental authority to deprive the baby/child of the resistance to the illnesses. But that argument against abortion was flatly rejected by the left, and has all but vanished from discussion.
* “I believe in taking responsibility for my health. I believe in giving my body what it needs so it can function the way it was designed to be. I’m aware that when disease strikes, I or my kids may be sick for a week or two, but will get over it with Hashem’s help.” – I challenge the responsibility of that statement. There are benign diseases that are hardly the threat they once were. In earlier generations, diseases that are mostly considered insignificant today were killers. Anti-biotics changed that. The development of strains of microbes that are resistant to these medications is an unfortunate side effect. That is a real issue. And I am a firm believer that אני ה’ רפאך. But that does not mean to avoid doctors, or to reject mainstream medical care. Hashem provided us with the advances in science and technology that enable us to study the human body and its functions, and to intervene in a great many ways to improve our health, well being, and longevity. But denying normal medical care is akin to staying home and not going to work since מזונותיו של אדם קצובין לו מראש השנה עד ראש השנה. That’s blatantly irresponsible. Hashem provided us with the avenues through which he will heal and cure us. False בטחון is not a mitzvah or a virtue.
* “You trust the government with certainty. I trust Hashem – my body’s designer with certainty.” – That’s a veiled accusation that vaxxers lack trust in Hashem. That is not only unfair and untrue, but a misrepresentation of what trust in Hashem means. The previous comment contains the reaction to this line of yours.
* “Can you understand that we never entered an agreement that I, who oppose vaccines will get vaccinated, to help protect you?” – We never entered into any agreement. But Torah Law is clear that causing someone else harm is completely ossur. I have no interest in your organic, vegan, gluten free, etc., diet. Those choices are yours alone, and no agreements with anyone else are needed. The situation here is the danger and risk you are inflicting on me. You may be entitled to your anti-vaxxing shittah. But you are not entitled to expose other people to disease. If there is an outbreak, your unvaccinated child is a potential threat to others, and should be restricted from those venues that place others at risk. Keeping these kids out of school is not unfair.
* “I ask you to stop with the hatred and cynicism that’s driving us further apart as humans on this planet, and as people of one nation.” – I concur 100% that hatred and cynicism should be banished. They are also threats to our health, emotional and spiritual, and even physical. However, the frank resistance to the banning of unvaccinated kids in school is without merit. Reality is that their presence provides exposure that has already sickened several hundred children, with several that are suffering from very serious conditions. You chose to raise your kids without vaccines, that’s your freedom. But imposing your freedom on others is unacceptable. We don’t hate your choice, just have a legitimate issue with imposing disease on our children. Our right to safety wins on this.
* “Do you want to set the stage for forceful laws and regulations regarding your health or religion to be imposed on you?” – Absolutely not! But just as I want our Halachic leaders and Poskim to provide me with guidance that insures my compliance with Halacha, I want the medical experts to provide me with the guidance to maintain my health. Are you opposed to warning labels on cigarettes or alcohol? If I choose to smoke, I may do so as long as it doesn’t impinge on others’ right to breathe air. I may not pump stinky second hand smoke into the room, with considerations of the foul odor and health consequences of second hand smoke. I want our government to make these laws and regulations. They employ the experts for these matters. We have Poskim to serve as the Halacha experts.
I commend your post for its delivery. I strongly disagree with many of your points. I am not looking to convince you of anything, but to be tolerant of our safety.