HaRav Nosson HaCohen Kupshitz Shlita, rav of the Nachla Menucha neighborhood of Ramat Beit Shemesh did not agree to meet with Beit Shemesh Police Chief Kobi Cohen as tensions continue mounting in the divided community.
The rav feels police have given support to the anti-chareidi reports of the media, and as such, he did not feel the meeting was appropriate. After mediation efforts the rav did agree to meet with the senior commander, including a number of local askanim as well. The askanim called upon police to stop providing escorts for media crews that have been spending days in their community, a most unwanted reality which the rabbonim feel simply serves as a provocation leading to additional violence.
The weekly BaKehilla reports the meeting ended on a positive note with both sides committed to work towards maintaining calm.
(YWN – Israel Desk, Jerusalem)
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20 Responses
Provocation, everything is a provocation. Why don’t people just go about their business and let the police arrest the violent demonstrators and spitters?
Is the Rabbi trying to protect the criminals? I would have thought he would want them to pay for their crimes.
” which the rabbonim feel simply serves as a provocation leading to additional violence.”
Very disturbing. There’s no permission to get violent unless it is in self defense when someone attempts to hurt you or to defend someone else being attacked. There’s no other excuse for violence. It must be stated in a firm manner by a panel of Rabbanim. I think its time they call an asifa and publicly denounce violence in clear terms. Not in a mild way like the Belzer Rebbe did. Make it unequivocal.
“The askanim called upon police to stop providing escorts for media crews that have been spending days in their community, a most unwanted reality which the rabbonim feel simply serves as a provocation leading to additional violence.”
These people just don’t get it. They have no right to dictate who walks on what street. They cannot stop any lawful activity anywhere, and the police are duty bound to protect everyone’s right to act in a lawful manner; the media included. Threatening to respond to that with violence is simply unacceptable.
“called upon police to stop providing escorts for media crews that have been spending days in their community”
what so they can beat them and break their equipment like they did last time. (its reminiscent of Nasser demanding that the UN peace keeping forces vacate the Straits of Tiran in the lead up to the 6 day war)
what does police protection against proven violence have to do with anything???
A lose lose situation all around.
To all the previous comments writers:
I lived in Nachla Umenucha for 6 years and Rav Nosson Kopshitz Shlita is a Godol Beyisroel. He is not a “Kanoi”.
This neighborhood is a closed neighborhood with all types from yerushalmim, to litvaks to sephardim to gerrer chassidim to reb arelach chassidim.
There is amazing unity and no fights there.
The sign on Chazon Ish street outside the shul that triggered this whole media campaign has been there for 10 years and no women were offended by it in the least.
Comes along some reporter and takes a shot of it and posts it to the international media. This triggered a huge anti-chareidi campaign that is still going on. Even CNN had front page pictures of this.
How can you blame these people for not wanting secular media to be wandering around and snooping for the next sign or action that they have no understanding of but in their eyes is a great news item to stoke the fire even more.
I am sorry but you guys cannot comment without visiting this neighborhood and seeing yourself how the liberal leftists in Israel have gone nuts.
BTW, I am a chutznik and not some extremist, but your comments are totally inappropriate at a time when the chareidi tzibbur needs to pull together and make a kiddush Hashem.
Why do the media keep going there; to stir the pot
The Rav should use his power to control or marganilize the kanoyum in his town. He is attacking the messenger while ignoring the message.
YITZCHOKY says:
December 29, 2011 at 12:02 pm
Why do the media keep going there; to stir the pot
So what if they do go to “stir the pot?” People may not like it, and it may even be distasteful. But it’s legal. Attacking them violently is not legal. That’s all the difference int he world. Someone is going to die in this conflagration. Doesn’t anyone see it coming? Does anyone care?
“The sign on Chazon Ish street outside the shul that triggered this whole media campaign has been there for 10 years and no women were offended by it in the least.”
That the sign was hung unlawfully for 10 years is irrelevant. No one, not even the rabbi of the neighborhood, has the authority to limit public access to a sidewalk. Individuals do not own the streets. A reporter was perfectly within his rights in reporting this unlawful act. The police were within the law in taking down the sign. It ends there. No one should try to defend the indefensible. How might people here feel if there were a sign in front of the Meretz headquarters asking that chareidim not pass on the sidewalk and that they cross the street?
have you ever seen the sign? it respectfully asks the women not to stand in front of the shul that’s all. there is no limitation for anyone to walk there.
No one is getting upset at the separate toilets or dorms that men and woman have? every one can understand that. but that people make it more comfortable for women on a bus bye giving them the back seats, so not every proste guy has to stare at them, no now we men are fighting for our own right to stare at every married or unmarried women.
Cantoresq, you obviously never saw the sign. There was nothing illegal about it and all it said was that women should not hang around on the sidewalk where the men come out of 3 shuls there.
The men want this and the women have no problem with it.
This is not New York. This is a totally chareidi neighborhood where everyone understands such a sign and respects it.
You have to understand that this incident was a totally anti-chareidi move and had nothing to do with law and rights etc..
The reason this sign even came to the attention of anyone after 10 years is because of the chilul hashem being perpetarted by some nuts outside the Orot girls school. perhaps if that craziness was stopped before it got out of hand there would have been no reason for the secular media to come snooping around the sign 9as did not happen for the past 10 years apparently). In order to get the secular spotlight off the neighborhhod it would be good for the neighborhhod to strongly, uneqivocally, publicly and finally put a stop to the sikrikim whose disgusting uncivilized behavior no one supports. They are the ones who brought this upon the peaceful heliga neighborhhod -oy lerosho oy leshcheno.
Why does it seem to me that American Jews are lecturing their Israeli counterparts about acceptable behavior? Would it be appropriate if Rabbi Kopshitz would lecture American Jewry about their politics???
That the sign was hung unlawfully for 10 years is irrelevant. No one, not even the rabbi of the neighborhood, has the authority to limit public access to a sidewalk. Individuals do not own the streets. A reporter was perfectly within his rights in reporting this unlawful act. The police were within the law in taking down the sign. It ends there. No one should try to defend the indefensible. How might people here feel if there were a sign in front of the Meretz headquarters asking that chareidim not pass on the sidewalk and that they cross the street?
“Cantoresq” Excuse me, but what absolute nonsense, do you write?!?
This is a area designated to Charedi residents only, and has every right to set rules according to the wishes and sensitivities of it’s inhabitants, in the same way that US LAW has no problem with the fact that in the town of New Square, they have men on one side of the road with women on the other so that no man has to walk in a way that a women is walking facing him,it is self understood that a closed neighborhood such as ‘nachla umenucha’ beit shemesh has every right to act proudly a tru torah Jews and protect themselves in any way that is necessary. A shame to all those commenters that have trouble in understanding such basic values and are just into buying every piece of garbage the secular media is selling you….
Actually, New Square has no legal right to segregate the streets as they do. Do not confuse the lack of a challenge to it, with legal authority. I’m confident that were anyone to challenge that ordinance in a court, it would be struck down as unconstitutional. But I’ll take keepsmiling’s logic at face value, and ask him/her the following: Do you support the right of a secular neighborhood to ban the construction of a schul, or to ban religious Jews from moving into the neighborhood, as part of “. . .every right to set rules according to the wishes and sensitivities of its inhabitants. . .?”
Cantoresq is both ignorant and foolish:
1. Israel has no constitition.
2. Haredim do have the right for tolerance, not anti-Semitism, from hilonim in a state founded as refuge for Jews of all types (not just for leftist hilonim).
3. The hilonim shuld have had the decency to observe the status quo with respect to the sign and buses, rather than taking perverse joy in trying to force haredim to violate their minhagim.
4. I am secular, but agree that the hilonim are going far out of their way to provoke (and defame) the haredim.
By the way, there are single-sex vehicles in a dozen countries, including Jpan and Mexico. The logic is that separating the sexes keeps men from getting misbehaving thoughts or actually misbehaving. The feminist left thinks this is good because it was proposed by the feminist left.
In Israel, there are mehadrin bueses. The logic is that separating the sexes keeps men from getting misbehaving thoughts or actually misbehaving. The feminist left thinks this is bad because it was proposed by haredim.
The feminist left are authoritarian hypocrites.
What a wasted opportunity! If the media were there, the residents of Nachal Umenucha could have made a huge kiddush Hashem by inviting them into a tisch, offering them a drink or a snack and showing them some true chesed! The only way to convince the secular media is by showing them how frum people really practice acts of kindness. Hopefully they will still have opportunity to do so, because after the Meah Shearim demo, the media will definitely return to BS. Imagine the headlines “we came to find fault and they overwhlemed us with kindness!” Every difficulty is an opportunity in disguise!
So you think you know better than the rov?!
The title of the article is not accurate if he did indeed meet with the police after interference from askanim. It makes the rav look wishy washy-he takes a stand and then capitulates. Obviously he only temporarily shunned the idea. I think it might have been worded in a way which was less inflammatory. “Rav reconsiders decision and decides to meet with police”.