Reply To: Davening Gemara

Hi RT:

Hi mochoh timcheh:

Salutations to you as well!

Having just arrived back from Pesach vacation, I saw this post and to put it mildly, I was severely disappointed that such a thread should exist.

Again, I quote the Chofetz Chaim of Sainted Memory: One who can learn on a better level qualitatavely and does not is over on bitul Torah. Therefore, i was inspired to write about what i percieved to be a complete lack of learning by someone who by all appearances, and certainly by his fluency and ease with the words of the gemara, looked to have the aility to actually learn with his mind and not merely his mouth. That in theory such a person should exist is not contrary to any known or unknown principle in Torah hashkafa.

First of all, may I humbly suggest that you pay attention to your own learning (& davening) and not be so intrusive of other’s derachim.

My point ws that it’s not learning mikol vakol, this being what i found offensive; there is no such valid “derech” in learning that involves not learning. I have nothing against any other derech in learning; aderabah, in vilna during the infancy of WWII when R Chaim Ozer ZT”L gathered many of the Eurpean yeshivos to Vilna, he kept them seperate bec a derech in learning is as much a chelek of Torah as the gemara itself and would therefore be a tremendous tragedy for a derech to be lost.

Secondly, reading and chanting ANY sefer is quite legitimate in and of itself.

There is no aveirah, true. But it is fooling yourself to think that that counts as Talmud Torah. (Tos says the two parts of the mitzvah is 1- yediah & 2- ameilus. ameilus is lacking obviously where you don’t really think; knowing a half baked idea in its utmost superficiality is not considered “knowing” exactly either.)

My father, shlit”a (& he should be gezunt bis 120 yahrs mit simcha) memorized a number of sugyas in Shas, so that when a shayla was presented to him, he could quote the mekor in those Gemaras instantly.

No one i know can memorize anything that fast, certainly not in such vast quantities.

True, we have a mesora specifically for Tanach, Mishnayos (Maggid Mishnah) and Zohar/Tikkunei Zohar, but as mentioned earlier, ANY sefer is pleasing to HaShem.

Again, i refer to the Chofetz Chaim i quoted earlier. (Besides, it is simply logical that if you have the choice of two mitzvos, the more pleasing one to HASHEM is greater, all else being equal, meaning just mitzad the kiyuis aspect itself.)

I am quite certain that there were critics and pessimists who offered the same response (as you did) when Daf Yomi was in its infancy back in the 1920’s — see how it has blossomed today and caught on to include Yerushalmi, Tosefta, etc…

While there were/are Gedolim who held that for a bachur in yeshiva, daf yomi would be detrimental (!), no one said it is like davening gemara at all.

Again, at this time of Sefirat HaOmer when the talmidim of Rebbi Akiva perished because they were “lo nohagu kavod zeh lazeh”, it behooves us to be a little bit more respectful of everyone, no matter what madgreiga they are in life, no matter what derachim they choose, no matter what minhaghim they practice.

I in no way am attacking the person. I do not pretend to know his life, personality, nisyonos, etc. I was merely pointing out that it’s a chaval that such a thing exists in the world, much as it is a chaval that there are tinokos shenishbos in the world, though i hardly think that we hold it against them.