[By Rabbi Yair Hoffman]
It is May 30, 1959.
Rav Moshe Feinstein zt”l pens a response to a Rebbe who is teaching in Rav Binyamin Kamenetsky’s Yeshiva of South Shore (IM EH Vol. I #96). The Rebbe, Rav Shmuel Dishon, had asked Rav Moshe about a certain individual artist who once had an excellent reputation. This artist had composed a number of musical compositions that had captured the hearts of the Torah community. Unfortunately, the artist had gone astray. Is it permitted to listen and sing the tunes that he had composed while he was still “fully kosher?”
[The issue has to do with giving a “good name” to evildoers which would violate a principle found in the Talmud (Yuma 38b.)]
Rav Moshe zt”l rules that there is nothing wrong with doing so for tunes that he had composed while he was “fully kosher.” For tunes that he had composed after his fall, Rav Feinstein writes, “it is likely that we should not be stringent since tunes do not essentially have to do with matters of Kedusha, however, Bnei Torah and Baalei Nefesh should avoid it.”
Rav Feinstein bases his ruling on the fact that some authorities (See Meleches Shlomo on Maaser Sheini) are of the view that the Yochanan Kohain Gadol who had promulgated many decrees in regard to Maaser Sheini – was, in fact, the same Yochanan Kohain Gadol who eventually became a Sadduccee. These decrees, however, were made while he was still “fully kosher.”
Rav Feinstein addresses the fact that the Rambam specifically points out that this was NOT the Yochanan Kohain Gadol who became a Sadduccee. Rav Feinstein writes that this would not mean that the Rambam held that it would have been forbidden to publicize his name along with the enactments – because why create a halachic argument on something when you do not have to?
He further writes that tunes, are essentially a matter that has nothing to do with a Davar Shebekedusha and should be no different than inventions of machinery or medicine.
THOSE THAT FORBID
Rav Menashe Klein (Mishneh Halachos Vol. VI #108), without mentioning the view of Rav Feinstein comes to the exact opposite conclusion and writes that it is entirely forbidden to do so – even in regard to the tunes composed while he was still “kosher.”
Rav Moshe Stern (Be’er Moshe Vol. VI #74 in the notes), the Debriciner Rav, also forbids the matter and even writes that it is forbidden to sell tapes of such individuals. Indeed, Rav Stern writes that one must even look into a person who would even stoop to sell such tapes. Interestingly enough, Rav Stern also does not mention the more permissive view of Rav Feinstein on the topic.
And while, most of the readership of this article, are not Skver Chassidim, the Halachic publication of the Skver Rebbe’s Kollelim (Zera Yaakov Gilyon #26) cites the more stringent view of Rav Moshe Stern in their halachic conclusions – ignoring entirely the view of Rav Feinstein.
ONCE AGAIN AN ISSUE
While this debate, at first glance, may seem to center about a somewhat esoteric area of Halacha, very recent revelations in other news, have brought this halachic matter to the fore once again. What is the status of Eruvin and other works and rulings of those that have gone astray?
The issue therefore calls for a closer examination of the sources that are cited in order to understand what is the actual halacha. The stringent view compares the cases to a Sefr Torah that is written by Apikorsim which should be placed in Geniza and not used. Rav Feinstein, however, cites the Pischei Teshuvah in Yoreh Deah (281:2) who rules that if the author of the Sefer Torah became an Apikores after he had written the Torah – there is nothing wrong with the Sefer Torah.
This latter point is highly significant and it is somewhat wondrous how the stringent authorities could have overlooked this Pischei Teshuvah.
Rav Feinstein further writes that the “giving a good name” would only refer to the period of time that he was acting properly and correct, and thus would not be considered a halachic problem. Rav Feinstein also distinguishes between matters of Kfirah – religious infidelity and matters of personal failing in the area of unseemly activity.
It is not that the personal failing in unseemly activity is not problematic. The Shach writes (YD 251:1) that someone who regularly fails in one area of halacha is deemed an Avaryan. The Netziv (Shailos uTeshuvos maishiv Davar Vol. I #8) has a responsa that deals with a Sofer who was not careful in his halachic observance and concludes that the Tefillin that he had written are still kosher, but do require examination.
TIMING IS CRUCIAL
Getting back to how the Be’er Moshe and Mishne Halachos might address the aforementioned Pischei Teshuvah, one can only assume that they questioned how it would be possible to ascertain exactly when the musician went astray. The answer to this question would lie in the notion of a Chezkas Kashrus (see Krisus 12a) – every person begins with the status that he is considered kosher until the moment when something new has clearly developed. Thus, even according to the stringent view one would have to research when the problems first began and only stay away from that which developed after that time.
Timing would also be an issue even according to the responsa of the Netziv – as one would have to ascertain what Tefillin the Sofer may have written after he became lax in his halachic observance. Indeed, even Rav Feinstein’s permissive view did not apply to Bnei Torah and Baalei Nefesh – timing would therefore be an issue for Rav Feinstein’s view as well.
It is also clear that Rav Feinstein’s lenient view was predicated upon the idea that music is essentially something that does not directly relate to Davar Shebekudasha.
What about Torah writings, however? This issue is also somewhat nuanced, as it depends upon how we understand the issue of Elisha Ben Abuyah mentioned in Rav Feinsteins’s responsa as well. Did all the Torah of Elisha Ben Abuya mentioned in the Talmud strictly come from the time period before he “went astray?” Rav Feinstein understands this to be the case, but other authorities explain otherwise.
One last thought. Might the halacha here be different if we were to view the fallen artist, or other person under discussion, as having been subjected to the throws of mental illness or addiction? Certainly, while the subject is yet under these influences and has not received treatment nor recovered, there would be no discussion and no distinction. But if it was determined that the “fall of the artist” was due to mental illness – and he had subsequently recovered – might the music of that era be permitted – even for Bnei Torah?
It is also important to note that in all this we must not lose sight of the enormous Chillul Hashem and damage to human beings that surround such questions. This also includes damage to the innocent family members of those who have gone astray. May Hashem prevent such devastation in the future and may we see only yeshuos and nechamos.
The author may be reached at [email protected]
20 Responses
very interesting article. But it is clear who this subject is about.
Rav Shmuel Dishon is 75 which means he was 20 when he wrote this letter and already a rebbe. Pretty impressive.
Elisha ben Avuya is mentioned in Pirkei Ovos even after he went astray.
“But it is clear who this subject is about.”
I believe that the original teshuva of Rav Moshe was about Carlebach, and I think that the present article is about Matisyahu.
Listening to music affects the neshama, such as Shabbos zemiros, the niggunim we use for davening, etc. We don’t listen to non-Jewish music for the very same reason–it affects the neshama. Music composed by a Jew off the derech has the same effect as Jingle Bells or Church music perhaps.
Is it? I can come up with a couple of possibilities.
“it is clear who this subject is about.”
In other words you are fishing for conjecture so you can confirm your own suspicions.
@geula: Then I guess I live on the moon
Wonderful piece! As a woman I dont have tha ability to learn as much as Id like, so I enjoy a good halachic responsa and even more an analysis of contradicting responsas anytime. Yasher koach!
Much as the author does wish it,the connection is tenuous
geula: You are correct and therefore, the whole discussion is totally irrelevant, as the person you allude to never strayed in the way mentioned by the so-called machmirim (apikorsus). Quite the contrary! And so, “puk mo amo diber”, the songs in question have spread far and wide in the jewish community and have become part of the Jewish liturgy fabric.
Say chop em down chop em down
I never submit any comments to this site but I am disappointed in yeshiva world news for posting this. You realize that most people know who you are talking about and if the person you are talking about will ever see this, it will just turn him off more. I know if it were me I would be turned off by this.This is not meant for a public forum it’s wrong and should be taken off.I don’t see anything positive coming from this.if you want to talk about it in a school that’s one thing but not here.I hope you take it off before it’s seen
Everybody relax why do you think you know who the article was written about. Is there only one singer who went off?
“What is the status of Eruvin and other works and rulings of those that have gone astray?”
#4 #11
iirc the author is referring to the recent scandal
#10
whatever is the case ,you’re eminently predictable
#10
So IM EH Vol. I #96 was wrong?
I guess lashon hara is okay as long as it is veiled under the thinnest of ambiguity.
@acaring….why is it wrong to post this? It potentially helps more people who care then the one person who does not.
#12 acaringjew – your comment doesn’t make any sense. The topic being discussed is what is the Halachic status of using the works of people that have left the fold (partially or fully). It seems that the main focus is not about Matisyahu being that the author states, “What is the status of Eruvin and other works and rulings of those that have gone astray?” I honestly don’t know whom he is talking about. Perhaps something recently happened in the States with some Rav.
Regardless, the point in question obviously applies to Matisyahu as well. The question asked is concerning listening to his music and whether there is also a concern with the issue of “Flattery”.
Nowhere in this article did the author disparage the people in question other than the obvious that they are off the derech; and that, I may add, they themselves caused.
acaringjew – you are reading into the article what doesn’t exist! It is highly unlikely that Matisyahu is going to be having hirhurei teshuva and then read this article and say, “THAT DOES IT!!! NOW I’M CERTAINLY NOT GOING TO SEEK G-D!”
Z MAN
from reading this piece, you are in disagreement with Reb Moshe regarding the kedusha of songs & tunes.
To the posters who question my judgment.First, the author refers to a teshuva y R,’Moshe in 1959!(by the way, R’Shmuel Dishon was not a rebbi then, he was still in yeshiva).It is pretty clear who this ‘shaale” and teshuva is referring to and it is also abundantly clear that the person in question never strayed in the way all other Poskim describe (minus , apikorsus). It is not even clear whether he strayed at all. Since then, the songs of this person (and nussach) have become part of Jewish liturgy.Indeed, “puk mo amo diber”