25 Responses

1. “Due to heavy traffic, and tens of thousands of people attempting to view the photos at the same time, the photos have been divided into four albums to ensure easier viewing”.

   Well, apparently the asifa was a resounding success, with most of Klal Yisrael resolving to hold off using the internet as long as they are able… (which is about as long as most people stick to new year resolutions…)

   Is it me, or is there something ironic about the various “Yeshivish” websites (you could stop right there and the irony would be sufficient…) publishing with enraptured detail on the internet, all of the details of an asifa of gedolim who implored Klal Yisrael to stop using the internet?

   (Is there something even more ironic, or even hypocritical, about me going on the internet to make a comment like this?) 🙂

2. EDITED Of course you won’t publish this…

   Moderators Note: By writing your “I dare you to publish this comment” line, over and over and over and over, it does not make us publish your comments.

   PS: Feel free to rent CitiField and make any Asifa you want, for any cause. We are sure that you will be highly successful, and do a huge service to Klal Yisroel.

3. it would be great if we could tag the albums with people that we recognize.

4. Congratulations on largest photo albums…but this isn’t journalism. No one has yet to actually write a report on what was discussed. I see from various secular newspapers reporting on this event this morning and I haven’t seen any Jewish orgs reporting on what was such a large event. You would think this would be the first article up this morning…

5. even if i would have went I would not have undertstood anything. 90% was in yiddish

6. Response to #1:
   The Asifa WAS a resounding success. The gedolim are not imploring Klal Yisroel to stop using the internet. They are requesting that people who have to use the internet for business etc should PLEASE install proper filters.

7. On a posting from yesterday Yeshiva World Moderator 42 stated “For those who can’t make it, I’m sure there will be all kinds of coverage to read through afterwards and hopefully there will be actual recordings as well”. I am with jstraz…… we want to read something about it, kindly where is the coverage Mr Moderator?

8. Some of us were unable to attend due to physical limitations. Can the speeches be made available either over the phone or on the internet (on a site that will make it through my filter)

9. #6: “They are requesting that people who have to use the internet for business etc should PLEASE install proper filters.”

   That’s it? That was the result of the asifa?

   Why did this very simple suggestion, which has been around for years, require a costly mass event with its attendant Bittul Torah and INCREASED use of the internet (blogs, picture postings, etc.)?

10. #6. The Asifa banned the internet except for bussiness purposes. The Jibo Rav said that no rebbe or yeshiva can have the iternet and it should never be broght into a home. Rav Wachsman said that if you do not abide by ICHUD guidlines you forfeit your share in the world to come.

11. The Organizers promised solutions and advice. All that was offerd were bans and threats. This was a wasted opportunity for all who really want to learn how to use the internet properly.

    It is most urgent that we form a new Vaad comprised of menahilim and shul rabbonim from accross the full spectrum of Orthodoxy who are capable of giving real guidence and providing real solitions to the masses of Klal Yisrael that do not reside in Lakewood and Monroe.

12. Newsflash

    Thank you for the positive words. So much negativity here its scary. I dont get it. This is a one time first time this ever happened. Its impossible to get it perfect. Rav Wachsman spoke brilliantly and powerfully. Even if someone didnt understand the Yiddish speakers, it wasnt necessary. The point was made clear for those who paid attention. For those who didnt get it:
    1. Everyone who has internet on any kind of device must have it filtered. Its a chiyuv and one who doesnt is possibly considered a Rasha as per Rav Don Segals drasha regarding darka achrina.

    2. Internet should only be used by those who need it for business. If you are a Rebbe or Rav or kollel yungerman you dont need it and should not have it. Included in that was STOP GIVING INTERNET TO KIDS OR YESHIVA BACHURIM. THEY DONT BELONG ON AN INTERNET PERIOD!

    3. Stop wasting time on the internet. If you must have it for work only use it during work time and if possible only have it in the office. Cut down on the bittul zman and start learning instead. Make a siyum on an internet masechta as Rav Wachsman said.

    Im sure there was more but this is the basics of what was said. I believe in the coming days there will be more info on filters and all that.

    If you need good filter info please check out (Yeshivaworld mods PLEASE ALLOW this link
    )
    http://www.guardyoureyes.com/index.php?Itemid=150

    Anyone who complains about the event and denigrates it and knocks gedolim is from the group of Leitzanim who unfortunately are very far from Hashkafas Hatora.

    We should all take a lesson from our Gedolim in what it means to be moser nefesh for our Ruchniyis. Rav Matisyahu, the Skulener Rebbe, as well as others who are old and not well put in incredible superhuman efforts for US, so stop with the petty complaining and show some appreciation. They care about our neshamos and want to save a drowning generation.

    One more thing, they are only human, the next time you want to take a cheap shot at Gedolim and Rabbanim, ask yourself how much effort YOU are putting in to your Ruchniyos. They can hold 1000 asifas but it wont help unless the individual decides to change and starts making his Ruchniyis a priority. We need to put in a lot more effort. Its ridiculous to think that after just merely attending an asifa you will be a different person. Now starts the hard part. Changing, working on our Kedusha and shmiras eynayim. Taking these issues seriously and recognizing that the only way to be close to Hashem is if we act like an Am Kadosh. A holy people.

13. To poster #2: you no doubt wanted it to be instead about child abuse, right? Just a guess. To #12: well said and absolutely right! The scoffers are unfortunately the ones wo needed the Asifa most and are already caught up in the filth and sins of the Internet. All we can do is hope they will do Teshuva and allow the light to come into their souls.

14. Does anybody know why almost all the speeches were in yiddush? Most of the crowd, including myself, that used the internet would have gotten alot more chizuck if there were more english speeches

15. #12 and #13

    So glad to see I’m not the only one with the head up. I myself had a fiter prior the Asifa, but still wanted to take upon an adittional good deed I removed all the favorites from my list so the next time I think of browsing shtusim and Divre Havoah (as per R’ Wachsman) I need to type up the domain – so that I think twice before I waste my time on things that are not important.

    As said with the people woh Nebach poke fun OR so called “don’t get it” (Don’t want to get it) Klal Yisroel always had within them these folks i.e. Erev Rav and the likes, the “smart” ones who understood beter than the Gedolim – even Moshe Rabbainu today wouldnt be good enough for them. We need to focus and constantly re-focus so that we don’t get them to be the majority R’L. We went last night for no other reason than to out number the outcasts of Klal Yisroel.

    There is no solution for the Klal, everyone needs tremendous Chizuk, my humble opinion is that such an Asifa should take place at least once a year.

16. I wanted to go, I really did, but when I called (this past Monday) the tickets were sold out. The publicity spoke about new ideas and new approaches. That’s what I really need personally. But from what I’m reading above, there was nothing like that at the Asifa.

    I’ll be very honest: I really don’t see the internet as such a terrible place. I am totally willing to admit that my viewpoint may have been hijacked by my yetzer hara, and that it is quite possible that the Internet is a worse place than I realize. And I probably need to hear that from someone greater than me. And that’s why I wanted to go to the Asifa, so that they could be mashpia on me to improve.

    The problem is that there are also some very good places on the Internet. But I honestly wonder if those who spoke at the Asifa are aware of that. The way it has been reported (such as by #10 and #12 above), they think the only value of the Internet is for business. But a GREAT deal of my Torah learning is done by the Internet! Why are exceptions being made only for business – why not for learning too?

    If the speakers do not mention these things, then it makes me think that they don’t really understand the Internet. And if they don’t understand it, how can they talk about it? How can someone pasken on a whether something is muktzeh, if he doesn’t know how that thing is used? Is this any different?

    Much of the advance publicity about the Asifa seemed to indicate that new ideas would be offered. Can someone PLEASE tell me what was new that hasn’t been said before? I was REALLY hoping that they would sway me to their views, and I’ll be reading Hamodia and Yated very carefully over Shabbos and Yom Tov, trying to find something new. But I’m not optimistic.

17. To #7: I have no control over what does or does not get posted here on the main site, I am just a CR moderator. The YW editor is posting what he feels is proper based on his Rabbanim.

18. #8: As far as I understand, it seems that the Ichud is trying to abide by their “no Internet” policy and therefore are not posting the speeches online. They are planning on releasing them on CD/DVD from what I understand.

19. CORRECTION:
    Viznitza Rebba Shlit”a said “Shema”
    HaRav Don Segal “Boruch Sheim”

20. #16

    Here we go again —

    NO, there is nothing new, it’s the same old Torah that has been given to us back thousands of years ago… Ain Chodosh tacahs Hashemesh it’s the good old truth that your Yetzer Horah doesn’t like to hear (at least you admit it in the beginning)

    No Chidushim! it’s an issue that needs tremendous Chizuk!! You, AND myself need to hear this time and again over and over and need to learn and Daven for rachmai Shmayim – we ALL need Seyata Dishmaya to stay pious in these challenging times…

    It’s like therapy needed for the heart and soul — slowly, but maybe surely it will enter the thickness of the heart and the Neshama we got from Hashem will shine through and realize that it was in Golus. PLEASE let the words of the Gedolim at least enter your ears…. remove that plug and let it set in.. and pray to Hashem to let it set in a way that you should be forever his – Amen!

    FYI,

    I use k9 web protection. It is super great, and best of all its free!

    http://www1.k9webprotection.com/

    (Just remember that someone else should have the password)

21. #20 — I don’t understand what you mean by “No Chidushim!” Are you suggesting that the Sefer Hachinuch should not have been written? All I’m asking for is a better understanding about what makes the Internet so much more terrible than the many other problems facing us. Repeating over and over “It’s terrible! It’s terrible!” is very effective for those who already understand and just need some chizuk, but many people such as myself NEED something more.

    And my second point is that the advance publicity (such as a lengthy article in Mishpacha two weeks ago) promised that there WOULD be new ideas and new suggestions, and that the Asifa would NOT be a simple rerun of what we’ve already heard. And I’m wondering what was said along those lines, because from what I’ve heard and read, there wasn’t anything like that.

22. Keeves,

    I love you, as a fellow Jew I beg you to take a better look and re-read what I wrote. I believe eventually it will enter your Neshama,

23. Lamid Vov Zaddik,

    I love you too. And I did reread what you wrote. But I don’t see any answers to my questions. I will now repeat some of those questions, just so there’s no confusion about what I’m asking:

    1) “there are also some very good places on the Internet. But I honestly wonder if those who spoke at the Asifa are aware of that.”

    2) “Why are exceptions being made only for business – why not for learning too?”

    3) “If the speakers do not mention these things, then it makes me think that they don’t really understand the Internet. And if they don’t understand it, how can they talk about it?”

    (Unfortunately, I cannot find my copy of that issue of Mishpacha, so I cannot quote the promises made by the Asifa organizers.)

24. Now I’m all for using filters and monitoring children’s internet access, but I’m not for banning it altogether.
    The fact that some people (not all) even have this opinion, or would even suggest it, shows that they’re only doing it for themselves.
    Banning technology or restricting it’s use (which I’m okay with) will only deal with the symptoms, is only taking the easy way out.
    However, they need to also deal with the root cause of the issue.
    Banning or restricting the internet isn’t going to stop people from wanting to access forbidden or dangerous content.
    The root cause is dealing with this generations need to be accepted regardless.

    This generation needs to be shown that the truth is not limited to the authority saying so, but that it’s absolute and applies to their point of view as well.
    Instead of looking at others from a self-centered point of view, instead of thinking that they alone are absolute and have the absolute truth and that all the other parts of them are separate and are their to be controlled and manipulated, they need to make room for all the different details, characteristics, viewpoints, and imperfections, which give them an absolute identity to begin with.
    Their self-centered view is only limited to the way they see it, it’s not absolute.In order for them to truly know themselves, to truly know that their view is absolute, they need to relate it to all the other points of view of themselves, to everyone else’s unique point of view, to the way everyone else sees the world.
    They need to also make room for themselves to be wrong. Being wrong is also a part of the truth, is also a part of the absolute picture.
    If they related to that other persons point of view, and that other person seems to have an agenda, then they shouldn’t pursue it any further. There is no reason for concern, because if there view is really a part of the absolute picture, then that other person will eventually realize that they are missing a piece to the puzzle. Therefore, instead of people shoving their views down others throats, they should have faith that that person will eventually come back on their own.

    Are they actually explaining to their children WHY the internet can be harmful?
    Are they telling their children IN A LOVING AND CARING MANNER, that they accept and support them regardless, that they’re really only trying to help, or are they just shoving their authority down people’s throats?
    Are they taking people’s nature, environment, what this generation is going through, what the needs of this generation are, into account?
    If not, then like I said above, they are only doing it for themselves.

    Some people use the G-D and Torah as a tool to keep us apart, because while its true that we are supposed to follow the laws, they don’t seem to understand that the rules and laws themselves are unlimited, that there is no one size fits all approach, that while the end goal is the same, there are unlimited routes and paths to get there, that people’s nature, environment, and the times of their generation must be taken into account, even if that requires them to change their approach!

    They need to apply the those rules and laws to this generation, whose task is to go beyond the letter of the law, and make it absolute,
    To stop limiting G-d to a creator/parent relationship, to a forced controlling relationship where we do everything he says, JUST because he said so, as opposed to knowing and feeling how the rules apply to us personally,
    To stop limiting G-D to flash and miracles, to a relationship which is limited and dependent upon everything being done for us, which is dependent and limited to everything going right, to a relationship which is not really our own,
    To show that we don’t need G-D as a parent anymore, that we are now able to find out that we are beyond circumstance, without all those flash and miracles, without growing up in a spiritual generation, to show and reveal G-D even in the finite natural laws, circumstances, and imperfections which conceal his presence, which in turn, allows us to reveal the G-D within ourselves, which allows us to do so without G-D getting in the way,
    To stop limiting G-D to laws and rules, because in essence, we’re all connected to G-D regardless, and the purpose of those rules are to show this connection, because you have to have something there first, in order to give it meaning, life, and purpose, in order to show the diversity within each and every detail as being a part of the whole.
    To stop limiting G-D to perfection and infinity, to show how G-D applies to everything from nature, science, evil, gentiles, imperfections, and sinners as well.

    It’s very scary for some people to get out of this Creator/Parent relationship, to reveal that G-D is absolute and applies to imperfections and the natural world, because it involves leaving the comfort of their childhood relationships, leaving the guidance and direction of being told what to do, it involves going into the real world, getting into contact with sinners, it involves getting going beyond beyond the letter of the law and accepting people for who they are, it involves delving into science, christianity, it involves seeing G-D in finite imperfections, it involves elevating things such as technology.

    (which can and should be elevated for the good, but can also be used for evil purposes.
    G-D created and told us to elevate the neutral and to stay away from the forbidden, because if there was no possibility of evil, if there would be nothing neutral, then there would be no freedom of choice.
    If there was nothing completely forbidden, then there would nothing neutral, because how would you know what’s good and what’s bad, without knowing first what’s evil and forbidden?
    Good can only exist in the presence of evil, because otherwise, the term good wouldn’t even exist.
    Evil can only exist in the presence of good, because otherwise, the term evil wouldn’t exist.
    The bridge between good and evil, is the neutral.
    Evil only has power in a state of confusion over whether it’s good or bad, because otherwise, you would know it’s evil, and reject it.
    Evil tries to get us to view things only on the surface.

    If the universe were just stuck in a PERFECT point of singularity, we would never get to know our true potential. Also, all the details of the universe would never be allowed to express their individual uniqueness, because they would be forced to conform to the singularity’s perfection, there would be no choice to reject, their would be no room for the expression and evolution of all the unique, details, characteristics, and viewpoints, which make it singular to begin with.

    But instead of wanting to elevate technology, instead of doing the work which is necessary to elevate G-D’s status, which includes having to fight the temptation to use it for evil, they would rather just live in spiritual paradise, they would rather live in their secluded communities, they would rather just be stuck in a perfect point of singularity, be stuck under the guidance of G-D as a parent and creator, rather than get to know they’re true potential, rather than get to know the other parts of themselves which make them singular and unique to begin with, rather than show and reveal that G-D is absolute, rather than show the G-D within themselves.
    Unfortunately, they are missing the whole point of creation).

    gentiles, sinners, etc, into G-DLY status.

    It involves them having to notice that their identity and oneness are not just one due to being separate and above everyone else, that the other separate (or what appears to be separate on the surface) details, characteristics, and viewpoints don’t take anything away from their singularity, but that those other details, viewpoints, and imperfections are what make them singular, unique, and perfect, in the first place, that they are really a part of them, that without them they would never know that they’re a part of the absolute bigger picture.

    These people unfortunately, have the same philosophy as terrorists.

    I also strongly believe that the reason for all these pedophiles and child molesters, is due to what I mentioned above, its due to not wanting to deal with all the hard work that’s involved in elevating the world, due to being jealous and wanting to go back to the comfort of being a carefree child.

25. #23

    We need to give serious thought on what can possibly be good on such a devastating devil upon us.. If I may say, it could very well be a way the Yetzer Horah works his way through with his “good intensions” and once he gets us entrapped its more in the lines of Hayom omer loch asai kach imocher omer loch asai kach etc…

    (Just saying)