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Using Maaser to pay for dates

(38 posts)
  • Started 3 years ago by lovebeingjewish
  • Latest reply from shlishi

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  1. i know i need to ask my LOR but was wondering if anyone knows if you are allowed to use and count maaser money towards paying for dates bc dating can be very expensive!

    Posted 3 years ago #
  2. yossi z.
    :D yossi :D

    Why should you be allowed to use maaser money for dating? Just because it is expensive? It isn't tzedoko (though you are allowed to buy seforim with maaser money they don't get included in din yerusha)

    Posted 3 years ago #
  3. dunno
    Better Late than Never!

    I'm with yossi z. on this one...why should it be allowed??

    Posted 3 years ago #
  4. Professional
    Member

    the question is good, and its food for thought: if dating is expensive, married life and iyh a family is much more, so time now to sit down and make a plan. you need an income. Midbar and Man from Shamayim are not given anymore. Better plan now then be stuck with harsh relaity, which can bring shalom bayis issues. Its not the Shver, its you who sign the Kesuba and take responsibility. Can you tutor? can you do hashgacha / cook for a camp during bein hazmanim? have yeshiva pay you to be in charge of some job there? I know someone who paid his own tuition for yeshiva by cooking for a camp every summer. you need some source of income to be and feel like a mentch. My humble opinion.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  5. yossi z.
    :D yossi :D

    Professional: that still doesn't rationalize using maaser for dates. How does it create any sort of connection between the two? What is the thought process of there even being a consideration for it?

    Posted 3 years ago #
  6. deiyezooger
    Say my name 6 times fast. cmon. TRY IT

    if i would be a rav..... i would say no with a big N. go somewhere cheaper.... or dont date if you can't afford it,have a beshow...... ok it's only a joke.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  7. not I
    Member

    Why not use ma'aser to pay for your car lease or rent.. It is expensive..

    Kollel couples still give ma'aser.. why shouldn't one pay for dates with money..

    Posted 3 years ago #
  8. Professional
    Member

    yossi, I agree with your post - prob cant use maaser, but if OP has issues paying for dates, I suggest he thinks how to afford a wife and a family, so no disaster is approaching... feeding a family is much more than cost of a date.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  9. L613
    Member

    Honestly, I agree with Professional. How are you planning on getting married if you can't even pay for your dates?

    Posted 3 years ago #
  10. showerzinger
    Member

    I'm going to have to agree with what many ppl have said so far: If you can't afford dating, supporting a family is going to be a MAJOR ISSUE

    Posted 3 years ago #
  11. DaasYochid
    a singular mind

    If you can't afford dating, supporting a family is going to be a MAJOR ISSUE
    That's assuming that there will not be any additional forms of income after marriage. However, there usually are.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  12. shlishi
    Joseph

    "How are you planning on getting married if you can't even pay for your dates?"

    ummm, poor people have just as much right, and even obligation, to get married as not poor people!!

    Posted 3 years ago #
  13. oomis
    Best Bubby EVER

    The OP asked a question about using maaser money to pay for dates, not for people to tell him whether or not he can afford to get married. Why can we not just address the question the person asked? If it is a shailah, ask your rov. I personally cannot see it as tzedaka, but it is being used l'shem mitzvah, so maybe that makes a difference.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  14. yossi z.
    :D yossi :D

    What I have been trying to say is just because something is expensive does not mean that you should be allowed to use maaser for it. Maaser is not just something to be used for any ol' mitzvah, it is supposed to be used for tzedoko. The heterim given to for example use maaser for tuition is because you are giving the money to a torah institution (supporting torah. One of the reasons why one is allowed to buy seforimn with maaser money. (though they don't have the ability to be "yarshened") even though it is ALSO benefiting you. Now if someone is poor enough to be receiving maaser they are able to use it for whatever they want (I am not sure about their own maaser)

    Posted 3 years ago #
  15. Although it's nice to see someone who wants to pay his own way and is not dependent on his parent(s), there is an alternative to dating and that is sitting in. Sit in on the first date and then see if it is worth for you to spend money. But don't think if you ask if you can use maaser money for dating and the underlying reason is to have a night out. Rabbi Waxman wrote a strong article about dating in Jewish Observer and writes how dating was an adopted custom from if i remember correctly Germany.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  16. popa_bar_abba
    Incorrigible; eccentric; somewhere between mean and average; sometimes only a bit over the top; arbitrarily engaged in cynicism.

    How are you planning on getting married if you can't even pay for your dates?

    After they are married, she will be paying the bills.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  17. Professional
    Member

    making a plan to work for earrning is such a logical thing to do. Right now, for every young person considering marriage. Marriage is a responsibility. The Kesuba you sign means exactly that. Rely on charities when you are young and able is lack of self respect. go get a job, like the Tanoim did.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  18. This is a serious Halachic Question that needs to be addressed by a Rav. The one who asked this question added "Because dating can be very expensive!" Expensive or not, the question remains can one use Maaser Money for shidduchim?

    I just spent some time searching for an answer and didn't succeed.

    I hope that a Rav will see this question and respond.

    Can the YeshivaWorld editors forward this question to a reputable Rav?

    Posted 3 years ago #
  19. SJSinNYC
    always pleasant

    Perhaps if you are going on a date as a chesed to the girl...

    Why in the world can this be maaser money?

    Posted 3 years ago #
  20. mw13
    Member

    oomis1105:
    "The OP asked a question about using maaser money to pay for dates, not for people to tell him whether or not he can afford to get married. Why can we not just address the question the person asked?"

    Couldn't agree more, though I probably would've worded it a bit more strongly myself.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  21. truth be told
    AKA tbt

    I may be incorrect, but I was told that R. Hershel Schachter of YU tells the YU "kollel guys to save most of the maaser money from their wedding gifts, for-- themselves, in order that they shall be able to remain in kollel a little longer once familial support etc stops.

    I wonder if he would pasken the same for the mitzvah of getting married.

    Please do NOT rely on my tbt's anonymous post, based on third, fourth or fifth hand information. (Especially if RHS is not your Rov).

    Where are the YU posters on this

    Posted 3 years ago #
  22. AinOhdMilvado
    Member

    I think this is a very good question, - to be asked of a posaik, not to be resolved here in the CR.

    The reality is that shidduch dates ARE expensive, and (since boys in the shidduch parsha are generally in yeshiva and/or college, and NOT working) they are usually paid for by the boy's FATHER.

    The question IS then, can he (the boy's father) pay for his son's shidduch dates from HIS maaser money?
    If anyone has gotten an answer from a Rov on this question, I would be very interested to hear it.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  23. yossi z.
    :D yossi :D

    Now that is a question being that a father has a responsibility to marry off his son (gemarah kiddushin daf lamed/lamed alef (I am not 100% sure of the exact daf). In regards to a kolel yungerman saving the maaser money for themselves this would have no bearing as to whether one can use maaser for dating (there are those that hold that people who learns in kollel are chashuv k'ani) and in regards to being able to afford a wife (and family etc) that is a whole other parsha and hopefully will at least be discussed on the dates. It has nothing to do with the question being discussed.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  24. oomis
    Best Bubby EVER

    I can actually see both sides of this issue being valid. WOW!

    Posted 3 years ago #
  25. tomim tihye
    Member

    There is an opinion that Ma'aser is a "minhag tov"; some Rabbonim hold by this.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  26. chayav inish livisumay
    One Tipsy Poster

    buying name brand clothes is very expensive, can you use maaser money??

    ragachovers assitant- how old are you?? 150??

    Posted 3 years ago #
  27. yossi z.
    :D yossi :D

    Tomim: ooh good point I didn't think of that

    Posted 3 years ago #
  28. ZachKessin
    Member

    ummm, poor people have just as much right, and even obligation, to get married as not poor people!!

    True, but you should still act your wage. If you are broke fine, do something you can afford. There are a lot of things you can do on a date for little or no money in NYC. It may just take a bit of being creative. (I won't give ideas as I am not a new yorker)

    Posted 3 years ago #
  29. always here
    and always on schedule

    sorry to go off topic, but: "dating can be very expensive!" ?! - for the majority of my daughter's dates in 2 yrs., all she had was a diet coke!

    Posted 3 years ago #
  30. DaasYochid
    a singular mind

    I don't see how it could possibly be considered maaser. Money spent on a previous obligation cannot be considered maaser, and getting married is a chiyuv (for a man). Any money spent above the minimum required to get married would not be part of a mitzvah at all. The only way I could see it being considered maaser is if the girl paid for the date!

    Posted 3 years ago #
  31. aries2756
    Smartness runs in my family.

    What if you gave your masser money to another young man in your situation who couldn't afford to date to help him get married, and then he did the same for you. Wouldn't that be a way of using masser money as a chessed and tzedaka? Is that a possible loophole to this dilemma?

    Or better yet, what if you gave your masser money to hachnosos kallah and maybe you will "find" the money you need to date and get married through the kind and generous chessed that you did. Mitzvah goreres mitzvah! And when you give tzedaka it comes back to you in multiples.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  32. DaasYochid
    a singular mind

    What if you gave your masser money to another young man in your situation who couldn't afford to date to help him get married, and then he did the same for you. Wouldn't that be a way of using masser money as a chessed and tzedaka? Is that a possible loophole to this dilemma?

    Yes, sounds good, but then he'd feel that his friend doesn't need to go to such a fancy restaurant!

    Posted 3 years ago #
  33. Professional
    Member

    a girl who works all day, comes home to spend time and effort to prepare for a date, deserves a nice dinner. If you cant afford, and have nothing creative for the date, why do you just let her know in advance..... She will have to decide if you are the guy for her. When someone I know was dating, asked for advice about a guy who seldom got her a drink, many times went to purchase after the register was closed, so he saved his $, and was told to look elsewhere. If he doesnt try to please you now, when will he?
    and if he has no money, let him try to earn. Shlomo Hamelech already said...

    Posted 3 years ago #
  34. chayav inish livisumay - You asked if I am 150 Years old?. First, thank you for the blessing for "Arichas Yomim". I assume that you are asking because how can I be the Ragochover's Assistant, when the Ragachover ZT"L passed away 1937?. So let me explain.

    When I was in Yeshiva, I was totally fascinated by the Ragachover. I learned his seforim, as much as I was able to understand, talked about him all the time, etc. So one of my good friends dubbed the name; "Ragachover's Assistant".

    I hope that clarifies matters.

    Posted 3 years ago #
  35. truth be told
    AKA tbt

    Professional: Good to see your sound advice, right on topic.

    I think there was a thread here once about going to restaurants on dates. Some girls didn’t like the idea, especially early on in the dating process. I guess they didn't know Shlomo Hamelech properly.

    What would be the seven items Shlomo would use to define a chochom?

    Posted 3 years ago #
  36. well it can add up! especially if the guy needs to go out with many girls being that the shidduchs are just not working..

    and buying dinner for a girl is not considered tzedaka?? lol

    Posted 3 years ago #
  37. Professional
    Member

    he is going out with many girls and it adds up?
    well, for calcualtion purpose, his future wife is going out with others at the same time, and others are spending on her....

    So it all evens out.

    and iyh she will make for him many many meals, 3 /365 a year for litvish, more if you are chassidish, so its a small investment..

    if the girl is 18, and she is not comfortable - ask her. It should be her option. "I would like to take you out for Dinner, would that be ok with you, do you prefer milchig or fleishig"

    Posted 3 years ago #
  38. shlishi
    Joseph

    if he is a poor bochor he has every right to date at a price he can afford. if that means a less expensive date that is his perogitive. and he does not have to announce it beforehand. if she is so shallow to not go out with someone who isnt up to her financial demands, that is her loss. she'll have to show her shallowness after the date. and in any event the first 2 or 3 dates are lounges mostly by young couples, so it shouldnt cost much in any event nor require any advance notice.

    Posted 3 years ago #

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