Click on the images to ENLARGE them. One image is the actual P’sak. The other images are the actual boxes of treifa chickens found; & the siezure notice from New York State: Here is the P’sak Halacha which was issued a short while ago to all those who have purchased meat or chicken from Shevach Meats which is located in Hatzlocha Grocery:
1) It is Asur to eat all meat and chicked which was sold by Shevach Meats. This includes what was sold to Catering Halls & meats that were sold to/from Hatzlocha Grocery.(THIS TRAGIC STORY HAS NO CONNECTION TO THE OWNERS OF HATZLOCHA GROCERY WHATSOEVER!!!!) This includes Chicken AND meat, from ALL Hechsharim; except for meats which were sold in THE ORIGINAL PACKAGING – AND have their original stamps and seals on them.
2) You must KASHER Keilim which were used.
3) Regarding which Keilim must be Kashered: Each person should speak to their individual Rov for a P�sak. What one should do in order to be Mechaper for this, each person should speak to their own Rov.
***URGENT INFORMATION*** While this was being typed, a prominent Monsey Rov called me to please advise everyone that this store was delivering meats to the CATSKILLS / Bungalow Colony�s. Please check to make sure that you did not have these meats in your possession (You might have brought the Treifa Keilim back to your city homes!!)
Please be advised that Shevach Meats LOST their Chezkas Kashruth (ALL CREDIBILITY) TEN YEARS AGO!! If you have EVER purchased meat or chicken from there in the last 10 years you must ask a Shaila immediately.
Besuros Tovos, YW Editor.
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14 Responses
Please be advised that Shevach Meats LOST their Chezkas Kashruth (ALL CREDIBILITY) TEN YEARS AGO!!
If that is the case how come Hatzlacha let him sell meat in his store? and why was there no uproar for the last 9 years while he was selling meat
Lost their Chezkas Kashrus 10 years ago??!! But what about any Hashgocho during that time? Isn’t the purpose of a Hshgocho to ‘add value’ over and beyond the standard Chezkas Kashrus which every Eid Echad has for Issurin? Seemingly whatever Hashgocho was overseeing the Shevach Meat operation (if any?) was simply relying on the same Chezkas Kashrus we all could rely on without the Hashgocho in place at all? So what benefit is such a Hashgocho adding for the end-consumer? Or was Shevach operating all this time without any Hashgocho whatsoever?
I’d like to have this clarified. Depending on whether or not Shevach was operating under a Hashgocho we either need to see a tightening of consumer practices (don’t patronize repackers who don’t have a Hashgocho) or we need to see a tightening of Hashgocho procedures (tighter control of inventory for repackers, beyond simply trusting them under the principle of Eid Echad Ne’eman).
I’d really like to know.
I guess you are not understanding what I wrote.
Let me explain it.
The Rabbonim are saying that he lost Chezkas Kashruth “LIMAFREIAH”!! Meaning that he indeed had a Hasgocha, and we trusted him……but since he was caught doing this now – there is a Machlokes between the Shach & the Taz if we can eat the meat that was bought prior to catching him. Or do we not trust him starting now.
The Rabbonim have decided to pasken that he loses all his credibility from before he got caught….and if anyone ever cooked this meat on Keilim they should see arov ASAP.
YW Editor.
IMPORTANT NOTICE TO MY READERS:
Please understand that Lashon Horah will not be tolerated on this website whatsoever. I realize that I’ve received well over 400 comments on this topic and I have deleted them all without posting them. I hope that you all understand why. If you have any message or question you can email me first at [email protected] and I will be more then happy to answer all of your questions.
Thanks,
YW Editor.
Hello Editor. I think you’re not understanding my question. I understand about the loss of Ne’emonos L’mafreiah. My question is, if competent Hashgocho procedures were in place over the past 10 years, then the basis for kashrus would rest on the integrity of the Hashgocha, and not on the owner’s personal Ne’emonos.
If the loss of Ne’emonos L’mafreiah results in a complete loss of Kosher status, isn’t this pretty much an admission that any Hashgocho during that time was pretty much worthless.
(BTW, when I use the term Hashgocho, I’m using it as a verb, rather than a noun. I understand that the Hashgocho agency involved is run from the top by an extremely Chashuve and Erliche Yid and I have no intentions Chas VeShalom to cast aspersions. However, using the term Hashgocho as a verb, it seems pretty obvious from the way the situation evolve, that the Hashgocho was lacking certain basic verification procedures.)
So can we expect to see any increase in the standards of supervision following this incident?
The bottom line is that unless you rely on the Shomer Torah Umitzvos owner — which is perfectly halachically acceptable — you’d need a staff of full-time mashgichim in every store. Checking to make sure that there are no off-site freezers, that no on is carring in a case of chickens from the trunk of a car instead of from the fridge [or that they aren’t carrying it in while the mashgiach is someone else access to the fridge]. Audting supplies vs. sales. And so on.
Every hashgachah has had some sort of problems. Most of the time it involved a halchically unacceptable problem (inadequately checking the processes or facilities), rather than being misled by someone who was (at the time) halachically trustworthy.
There’s a saying that locks only help protect against honest people. This hashgachah appears to have be halachically adequte.
i read what you wrote about receiving over 400 comments which were deleted-its something to be respected.
I spoke to some members of a kashrus hashgocha (noun). One member said that the difference of when they give a hashgocha to a goyishe establishment and a frum establishment is that by the non frum – they do not allow the owner to possess a key to the kitchen. The owner is never allowed in to his kitchen without the mashgiach being there. For frum people, they do allowed it. This person has been advocating for years to not allow frum owners the key either. He has brought this case up in their organization to bolster his opinion. By the way, he told me that his organization’s rules are that when any food ingredients are received by the caterer, it may only be received and signed for by the mashgiach (even with frum owners).
I have hear Rav Orbach (one of signers of the Gilui Daas) speak on this subject now twice. These are what I think the are extremely important points:
1. The Steipler Gaon zt”l said that there is no mashgiach who cannot be tricked by a determined bal habayis.
2. The Rabbanim have looked into the hashgacha practices followed in this case and did not find any fault with it.
3. A person who has eaten treif b’shogeg will not lose Olam HaBa on that account, but ONE WHO IS MEVAZEH A TALMID CHACHAM does really have to be concerned! Just the small sample of careless words that I have heard this morning are a clear sign of a FAR BIGGER DISASTER in Lashon Hora, Motzi Shem Ra, threats and other abuse directed at the Rav haMachshir and the Mashgiach.
If the Rabbanim saw fit to declare Yom Taanis due to this kishalon in kashrus, how many taaneisim will be sufficient for the disgaceful reaction of segments of the tzibbur?
In many out of town cities they make a Loi Plug – full time mashgichim in all meat stores. There is no difference if the owner of the store is frum or not. Maybe such a rule should be instituted in NY and NJ also…
That’s why we love this site!
Hello art.
> … The bottom line is that unless you rely on the Shomer Torah Umitzvos
> owner � which is perfectly halachically acceptable � …
Of course, Eid Echad Ne’eman B’issurin. What I’m having trouble with, if the Mashgiach’s whole system relies on Ne’emonus, then what do we need the Mashgiach for at all? I can trust the owner on the basis of Eid Echad Ne’eman just as well as the Mashgiach can. So what value is the Mashgiach adding here?
Kosher consumers pay extra for an added level of assurance that the food they’re buying is Kosher. It seems though that there’s no added level of assurance being provided.
Maybe I’m missing something. Maybe there’s some complexity to the whole food chain that I’m missing here. Probably. I’m willing to be educated.
Also, would anyone trust a slaughterhouse whose Kashrus is based on a Yotzei V’Nichnas basis? No way. I’m betting that those environments, in which the meat is originally ‘marked’ are strictly controlled anvironments. So why then do we allow a much greater leniency for a repackaging environment where the butcher is dividing the ‘raw material’ into smaller portions an re-marking those smaller portions? At the very least, shouldn’t his freezer be controlled so that the Mashgiach is aware of every crate going in or out? From that point on it is a simple matter of inventory control to ensure that he’s selling exactly what he receives.
> This hashgachah appears to have be halachically adequte.
It would be halachically adequate to have no Hashgocha whatsoever, and to simply rely on the principle of Eid Echad Ne’eman B’issurin. But that’s just not the accepted standard. Don’t we need better controls over repackaging environments?
WE daven every day ” al tevieinu lidei nisayon”. This is not a joke. We should take our tfilos seriously. We should learn a Mussar Haskel from this story that nobody is immune to the Yetzer Hora. If a person who is Muchzak as a Talmid Chochom and Baal Tzedokoh etc. can falter anyone can. We all need Siyata d’Shmaya
We must be m’chazek ourselves with Torah and Mitzvos and may we be Zocheh to a Ksiva v’Chasima Tova and to the Geulah Shleimah B’korov. Amen!
Hello Yus —
I’m not sure what you mean by yotzei v’nichnas at a slaughterhause. Every animal needs bedikah.
You’re right about the eid echod part, the problem is that most of us don’t know the vendor. Obviously here the Rav HaMachshir — and many others who thought they knew the butcher — didn’t really know him either.
Let’s imagine that this was the scenario: It’s three weeks ago Shevach is owned by a different person, who was eactly as observant as the owner of Shevach, and the owner of Shevach would have been employed as the Mashgiach by the Rav Hamachsir, would anyone have suspected that the Mashgiach was an oisvorf or otherwise unqualified ? Absolutely not. Yet the same thing that happened would still have taken place, just with the collusion of the owner and the mashgiach.
And I ask you again: When the Mashgiach is the only one with the key and they’re bringing a delivery into the fridge (or taking it out), whose preventing another employee somewhere from carrying in a case or two of chicken from a different door, directly into the working area? We always have to rely on some degree of neemanus or mirsas.
And maybe this is a wake up call not to trash the Rabbanim or to discount the Shulchan Aruch but to recognize that despite the high standards we’ve set for ourselves, teh Aibishter is telling us that we’ve got a ways to go. Just over two weeks till Rosh Hashanah…let’s get moving!